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[Libran]

Rest of South Africa v Indians, Benoni

Chappell defends Indian team after disappointing start

November 17, 2006

Greg Chappell, the coach of the Indian team, has sought to deflect criticism of the team's disappointing performance in the first match of their South African tour, saying the players had been pitted against quality opposition without adequate time to adjust to the local conditions.

"It can happen, stepping out of the airplane and playing in two days' time against genuine quality bowling. But that's the only way you are going to learn," Chappell said in a stout defence of his players after the 37-run loss to Rest of South Africa in a warm-up game on Thursday. Chasing a target of 256, the Indians were blown away by the express speed of Dale Steyn, who finished with five for 22 from ten hostile overs.

"I don't know too many players who are well equipped to handle real fast bowling when they first walk on to the international stage. Most of them have to get used to it by experience," Chappell said. ...For how long Guru
Not only did the batsmen find the going tough, even the bowling came apart in the final overs, with Munaf Patel and Sreesanth both going for more than 60 runs. "We gave a couple of guys an opportunity of bowling in the death overs which they haven't done before. If you want to get better you have got to have those opportunities," Chappell said. "Sometimes it is a painful initiation you have to go through. But then you learn the lesson." ...Heard this before?
Chappell also felt Mahendra Singh Dhoni has now been part of international cricket long enough to take on more responsibility. "He is going to get better if he takes risk and bears responsibility. I think MS is ready for that role. He has played a reasonable amount of international cricket now."

The one Indian batsman who played a long innings was Rahul Dravid, who made 79, and Chappell felt there was a lot that the younger members of the team could learn from him. "Rahul goes through difficult periods. He did what he has to go to get through those periods. You sometimes don't look very good and you could rather appear uncomfortable. And yet if you go through you gain confidence. It could make it easy next time. It's not something you can teach somebody. It's something you learn by experience. Rahul has learnt it as well as anyone has ever learnt it."

Chappell also found words of praise for Anil Kumble and Zaheer Khan, the two bowlers returning to India's fold. "Zaheer brought his experience to good use and Kumble is the consummate professional. He does everything that needs to be done. He plays with youthful enthusiasm which belies the number of years he has played international cricket."

http://content-ind.cricinfo.com/rsavind/content/current/story/268692.html

[achutank]

THE SHAH OF BLAH

[achutank]

THE SHAH OF BLAH


why say anything at all? they played badly. so happens. does he need to give us people a lecture on it. this team will improve when this man learns to shut up.

[justforkix]

"I don't know too many players who are well equipped to handle real fast bowling when they first walk on to the international stage. Most of them have to get used to it by experience," Chappell said. ...For how long Guru

Who are these newcomers ?!? - SRT ?!? MK ?!? DM ?!? MSD ?!? - what rubbish is this....

[Libran]

THE SHAH OF BLAH

 

[Libran]

"I don't know too many players who are well equipped to handle real fast bowling when they first walk on to the international stage. Most of them have to get used to it by experience," Chappell said. ...For how long Guru

Who are these newcomers ?!? - SRT ?!? MK ?!? DM ?!? MSD ?!? - what rubbish is this....

He seems to be parroting something that he thinks applies universally and for all occassions....Sometimes saying nothing sends a better message than blabbering away to stardom


And the captain seems to think


How I wish this guy does not open his mouth

[ruchir]

"I don't know too many players who are well equipped to handle real fast bowling when they first walk on to the international stage. Most of them have to get used to it by experience," Chappell said. ...For how long Guru

Who are these newcomers ?!? - SRT ?!? MK ?!? DM ?!? MSD ?!? - what rubbish is this....

Countries where will you find fast, bouncy wickets: ENG, NZ, SA, AUS.

Newcomers (relatively) in the side that played practice game: WJ, MSD, SR, DM.

DM - played only 14 ODIs in ENG, NZ, SA, AUS in 6/7 years. How much experience will he have?
MSD - has not played any ODI in ENG, NZ, SA, AUS.
SR - has not played any ODI in ENG, NZ, SA, AUS.
WJ - first ODI series.

Experienced player in this game: SRT, RD, MK

MK, RD - one played upto his career avg, other played good.
SRT - FAILED. Of late, he has been plauged with this problem.

You can't win a match where only one batsman plays well and 2 others are just average. 5 batsmen failed because they could not handle fast bowling on bouncy wickets. 4 of them really are newcomers (or relatively) to these conditions. I think if GC was talking about DM, MSD, SR, WJ. Add to that, the failure of SRT. He is not exactly saying anything untruthful.

Also, if he has not said anything, people would surely have said he is hiding failure. Now, that he said the truth, people say why is he speaking at all. Lose, lose situation for him.

[Aloo Kashmiri Ul Haq]

you guys wont believe me, but there is a patch up between balaji telefilms (the honcho being ekta kapoor of course) and Greg Chappell. The BCCI recognized the disregard for cricket among housewives and has since been working on it. Do not worry we will have a "Mihir" soon!

[dave_dj]

I think if GC was talking about DM, MSD, SR, WJ. Add to that, the failure of SRT. He is not exactly saying anything untruthful.

Also, if he has not said anything, people would surely have said he is hiding failure. Now, that he said the truth, people say why is he speaking at all. Lose, lose situation for him.

WOW - even GC does not work as hard as Ruchir does for his excuses.  I think now it all makes sense.  Given that all these players are new with no experience in bouncy pitches, we should expect to lose quite logically.  Then in the next tour, we will take some different players to continue our experiments (as we know that experiments should go on) and should again expect to lose in our usual logical way.  I think we are in the right track - we are working on a ten year plan to create a phenomenal cricket team that will rule the world starting 2020.  If only we had visions like GC and intellect like Ruchir to fathom those visions of GC.  We can rest now or rather go to sleep.  Somebody wake me up at 2020 - I need to be all prepared to enjoy the those upcoming glorious days of Indian cricket.

[ruchir]

WOW - even GC does not work as hard as Ruchir does for his excuses.  I think now it all makes sense.  Given that all these players are new with no experience in bouncy pitches, we should expect to lose quite logically.  Then in the next tour, we will take some different players to continue our experiments (as we know that experiments should go on) and should again expect to lose in our usual logical way.  I think we are in the right track - we are working on a ten year plan to create a phenomenal cricket team that will rule the world starting 2020.  If only we had visions like GC and intellect like Ruchir to fathom those visions of GC.  We can rest now or rather go to sleep.  Somebody wake me up at 2020 - I need to be all prepared to enjoy the those upcoming glorious days of Indian cricket.

I will leave your sarcasm out. Let us see your other point:

Experiments -- Same players, SRT, MSD, MK, SR, won quite a few matches for us playing in India-like wickets in recent past. So, there is no reason for them to be dropped, is there? You could drop SR, but then ask Vengsarkar as to why he is still there. You don't expect Vengsarkar to cow down before GC, do you? WJ is a replacement for YS. Again, ask Vengsarkar why he was selected. Point is most of the failed players in SA were performing well in Indian conditions. It is not a false statement that there were a few player in the practice game team who were fairly inexperienced in SA-like wickets. Add SRT's failure to that.

Different player on next tour -- Who knows who will be selected for next tour. If new players are selected again, don't blame GC only. Blame the selectors of that time too, because they are ultimately responsible for selecting new/inexperienced players for that tour. They are responsible for cowing down to GC (if they do).

Vision of GC and my intellect -- What can I say? You are even better than me in intellect 'cause you were able to corelate my post with what GC said and were able to come up with a resoning that I was defending him. Not that you are wrong there. I actually was defending that particular statement of GC because, as I proved in my post, it looked true.

Truthfulness -- In all your sarcasm, you still did not clearly and unambiguosly say that whatever I wrote is factually incorrect or does not support my point that GC's that particular statement is true. You can argue why inexperienced players were selected. Fine. But once selection is complete, team has to play with available resources and GC pointed out that from the avialable batting resources many were inexperienced in SA-like conditions and I found that to be true.

[suraj]

I think if GC was talking about DM, MSD, SR, WJ. Add to that, the failure of SRT. He is not exactly saying anything untruthful.

Also, if he has not said anything, people would surely have said he is hiding failure. Now, that he said the truth, people say why is he speaking at all. Lose, lose situation for him.

WOW - even GC does not work as hard as Ruchir does for his excuses.  I think now it all makes sense.  Given that all these players are new with no experience in bouncy pitches, we should expect to lose quite logically.  Then in the next tour, we will take some different players to continue our experiments (as we know that experiments should go on) and should again expect to lose in our usual logical way.  I think we are in the right track - we are working on a ten year plan to create a phenomenal cricket team that will rule the world starting 2020.  If only we had visions like GC and intellect like Ruchir to fathom those visions of GC.  We can rest now or rather go to sleep.  Somebody wake me up at 2020 - I need to be all prepared to enjoy the those upcoming glorious days of Indian cricket.

Return of the Global Moderator

Glad to see you are still alive and kicking

[dave_dj]

Don't sweat it, Ruchir.  It does not matter if it is you or me, we all come up with excuses after excuses to defend a team of players who make unimaginable amount of money but do/did not deliver.  We never seem to stop tolerating their failures though.  I don't care who selected whom, what's the recipe for today's experiment or whatever, where is the result?  GC gets top dollars for his job and he has created lot of raucus, divided Indian cricket fans but where is the result?  Before GC, we used to go to the finals and fail to deliver (it's still bad for a country of billions that pay millions to their cricketers), now we have even stopped going to the semi-finals.  Is this progress in Indian cricket that is worth defending?  I urge you to stop defending and demand results for your time and emotional investment.

[gouravk]

I dont think defending our own team is a crime at all. Yes they played badly but does not mean we disown them .Fact is this the team that has been selected for the SA series and we have got to back it

[ruchir]

Don't sweat it, Ruchir.  It does not matter if it is you or me, we all come up with excuses after excuses to defend a team of players who make unimaginable amount of money but do/did not deliver.  We never seem to stop tolerating their failures though.  I don't care who selected whom, what's the recipe for today's experiment or whatever, where is the result?  GC gets top dollars for his job and he has created lot of raucus, divided Indian cricket fans but where is the result?  Before GC, we used to go to the finals and fail to deliver (it's still bad for a country of billions that pay millions to their cricketers), now we have even stopped going to the semi-finals.  Is this progress in Indian cricket that is worth defending?  I urge you to stop defending and demand results for your time and emotional investment.

a team of players who make unimaginable amount of money but do/did not deliver.  We never seem to stop tolerating their failures though. -- Totally agree with you here. like true blue indian fans we do tolerate trash that is dished out by our team regularly. I, too, am a part of this mentality.

Before GC, we used to go to the finals and fail to deliver (it's still bad for a country of billions that pay millions to their cricketers), now we have even stopped going to the semi-finals. -- I don't know how best to put it across, but since GC took over, we have played 3 ODI series of more than 2 teams - in SL, ZIM, MAL. We reached the finals in SL and ZIM but failed to win them. So, there is not much to complain about not reaching the finals under GC. It's just that since mid-2005 we have played only 3 such series.

Is this progress in Indian cricket that is worth defending?  I urge you to stop defending and demand results for your time and emotional investment. -- Hardly worth defending. In fact, I see our team slipping at the moment. I agree with you that we fans should DEMAND more favorable results and we do too. Demand is there, supply is not.

My reason for writing the initial post was to comment on the fact that that particular statement of GC was being considered as false or objectionable but I found it to be true. GC may have used it as an excuse for the team, but the statement is still true.

Look, trash GC or RD or SRT or whoever, when they fail. But at least use the right argument while trashing them. My opinion is that that particular statement was not the one to be used to trash GC.

[dave_dj]

I am hardly interested if GC's statement is technically correct - all I, like you and many others, am looking for is results.  We have gone to finals of 2000, 2002 ICC Championship and 2003 World Cup but since 2004 ICC Championship, we don't even reach the semis - that is pathetic for a group of highly paid professionals - it does not matter if SF/JW or RD/GC leads the management team.  Only thing against GC is that he has created lots of noise delivering almost nothing.

[dave_dj]

It is quite interesting that somebody smites me for demanding results from the Indian team.  You know who - I would appreciate if you come forward and tell me what else should I be asking for from this Indian team.  I am sincerely confused to learn that somebody thinks it is wrong for me to demand results for a group of highly paid professionals.

[suraj]

I am hardly interested if GC's statement is technically correct - all I, like you and many others, am looking for is results.  We have gone to finals of 2000, 2002 ICC Championship and 2003 World Cup but since 2004 ICC Championship, we don't even reach the semis - that is pathetic for a group of highly paid professionals - it does not matter if SF/JW or RD/GC leads the management team.  Only thing against GC is that he has created lots of noise delivering almost nothing.

How true- nothing succeeds like success and nothing fails like failure. Any statement or process can be drawn out to look somewhat positive or somewhat negative, somewhat right or somewhat wrong but eventually the goal has to be accomplished; rest is all BS talk

[justforkix]

"I don't know too many players who are well equipped to handle real fast bowling when they first walk on to the international stage. Most of them have to get used to it by experience," Chappell said. ...For how long Guru

Who are these newcomers ?!? - SRT ?!? MK ?!? DM ?!? MSD ?!? - what rubbish is this....

Countries where will you find fast, bouncy wickets: ENG, NZ, SA, AUS.

Newcomers (relatively) in the side that played practice game: WJ, MSD, SR, DM.

DM - played only 14 ODIs in ENG, NZ, SA, AUS in 6/7 years. How much experience will he have?
MSD - has not played any ODI in ENG, NZ, SA, AUS.
SR - has not played any ODI in ENG, NZ, SA, AUS.
WJ - first ODI series.

Experienced player in this game: SRT, RD, MK

MK, RD - one played upto his career avg, other played good.
SRT - FAILED. Of late, he has been plauged with this problem.

You can't win a match where only one batsman plays well and 2 others are just average. 5 batsmen failed because they could not handle fast bowling on bouncy wickets. 4 of them really are newcomers (or relatively) to these conditions. I think if GC was talking about DM, MSD, SR, WJ. Add to that, the failure of SRT. He is not exactly saying anything untruthful.

Also, if he has not said anything, people would surely have said he is hiding failure. Now, that he said the truth, people say why is he speaking at all. Lose, lose situation for him.

I don't know too many players who are well equipped to handle real fast bowling when they first walk on to the international stage. Most of them have to get used to it by experience

Wasn't DM selected based on his county performances in England ?!? Also, DM plays for Punjab at Mohali (the bounciest pitch in India for sometime).

Didn't MSD face Chuckter, Lee, Bond, Taylor, Edwards, Freddie, Harami in the last 1 1/2 years ?!?

Also, WJ has played Freddie, Harami, Edwards, Taylor.

A simple statement like players will take a game or two to handle the different conditions - pacier and bouncier - will suffice. Not some blanket profound rubbish like this.

[gouravk]

To be quite frank English pitches are hardly challenging from the point of view of pace and bounce. Also Mohali's bounce is nothing but a myth. So that takes care of the Dinesh mongia case.

MSD has faced all these bowlers exclusively on subcontinental wickets.

South African wickets are an altogether different kettle of fish if they don't flatten them out like they did in the WC.

[Libran]

It is quite interesting that somebody smites me for demanding results from the Indian team.  You know who - I would appreciate if you come forward and tell me what else should I be asking for from this Indian team.  I am sincerely confused to learn that somebody thinks it is wrong for me to demand results for a group of highly paid professionals.

don't sweat it out Dave...you have been here long enough to see the highs and lows of this team and the GC syndrome that has taken over a lot of people who can put out lines and lines of arguments in favor of the Coach and in the same breath attempt to browbeat any logical and fact base explanations of the other side of the issue....

And for the smites...well...does that make a diffference to the truth...in my view ...NO

The same people who went to town on the Coach and his immensely tested abilities at Coaching are clasping at every possible thing to read between the lines and prove the Coach right....life comes a full cycle

[toney]

Don't sweat it, Ruchir.  It does not matter if it is you or me, we all come up with excuses after excuses to defend a team of players who make unimaginable amount of money but do/did not deliver.  We never seem to stop tolerating their failures though.  I don't care who selected whom, what's the recipe for today's experiment or whatever, where is the result?  GC gets top dollars for his job and he has created lot of raucus, divided Indian cricket fans but where is the result?  Before GC, we used to go to the finals and fail to deliver (it's still bad for a country of billions that pay millions to their cricketers), now we have even stopped going to the semi-finals.  Is this progress in Indian cricket that is worth defending?  I urge you to stop defending and demand results for your time and emotional investment.

a team of players who make unimaginable amount of money but do/did not deliver.  We never seem to stop tolerating their failures though. -- Totally agree with you here. like true blue indian fans we do tolerate trash that is dished out by our team regularly. I, too, am a part of this mentality.
...

Is it actually fair that time and again, this money factor is brought into the discussion? Sure, the players earn a huge amount of money. But is that actually a factor in performing badly? You both dont say this directly but certainly seem to be suggesting it. Frankly, you both sound like Bishen Singh Bedi.

[dhruvdeepak]

Don't sweat it, Ruchir.  It does not matter if it is you or me, we all come up with excuses after excuses to defend a team of players who make unimaginable amount of money but do/did not deliver.  We never seem to stop tolerating their failures though.  I don't care who selected whom, what's the recipe for today's experiment or whatever, where is the result?  GC gets top dollars for his job and he has created lot of raucus, divided Indian cricket fans but where is the result?  Before GC, we used to go to the finals and fail to deliver (it's still bad for a country of billions that pay millions to their cricketers), now we have even stopped going to the semi-finals.  Is this progress in Indian cricket that is worth defending?  I urge you to stop defending and demand results for your time and emotional investment.

a team of players who make unimaginable amount of money but do/did not deliver.  We never seem to stop tolerating their failures though. -- Totally agree with you here. like true blue indian fans we do tolerate trash that is dished out by our team regularly. I, too, am a part of this mentality.
...

Is it actually fair that time and again, this money factor is brought into the discussion? Sure, the players earn a huge amount of money. But is that actually a factor in performing badly? You both dont say this directly but certainly seem to be suggesting it. Frankly, you both sound like Bishen Singh Bedi.

to be precise: the players earning huge wads of money that most of us may never see in our lifetimes should have no bearing on how devoted us fans should be. take the team and assess what you like and dislike about it on cricketing terms. sure there is an emotional component that comes from the nationalistic side, but i agree with toney...lamenting that they earn tons of money is no solution. sometimes you have to accept that there are better teams out there.

[jaat69]

Don't sweat it, Ruchir.  It does not matter if it is you or me, we all come up with excuses after excuses to defend a team of players who make unimaginable amount of money but do/did not deliver.  We never seem to stop tolerating their failures though.  I don't care who selected whom, what's the recipe for today's experiment or whatever, where is the result?  GC gets top dollars for his job and he has created lot of raucus, divided Indian cricket fans but where is the result?  Before GC, we used to go to the finals and fail to deliver (it's still bad for a country of billions that pay millions to their cricketers), now we have even stopped going to the semi-finals.  Is this progress in Indian cricket that is worth defending?  I urge you to stop defending and demand results for your time and emotional investment.

a team of players who make unimaginable amount of money but do/did not deliver.  We never seem to stop tolerating their failures though. -- Totally agree with you here. like true blue indian fans we do tolerate trash that is dished out by our team regularly. I, too, am a part of this mentality.
...

Is it actually fair that time and again, this money factor is brought into the discussion? Sure, the players earn a huge amount of money. But is that actually a factor in performing badly? You both dont say this directly but certainly seem to be suggesting it. Frankly, you both sound like Bishen Singh Bedi.

to be precise: the players earning huge wads of money that most of us may never see in our lifetimes should have no bearing on how devoted us fans should be. take the team and assess what you like and dislike about it on cricketing terms. sure there is an emotional component that comes from the nationalistic side, but i agree with toney...lamenting that they earn tons of money is no solution. sometimes you have to accept that there are better teams out there.

Hmm....not to distract into what they are earning or not..............they are playing very poorly. It is one of those rare times in quite a while, when we are having to concede that there are better teams than ours!

[kban1]

to be precise: the players earning huge wads of money that most of us may never see in our lifetimes should have no bearing on how devoted us fans should be. take the team and assess what you like and dislike about it on cricketing terms. sure there is an emotional component that comes from the nationalistic side, but i agree with toney...lamenting that they earn tons of money is no solution. sometimes you have to accept that there are better teams out there.

is that with or without the "P" ?