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achutank

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is obama going to turn into india's enemy no. 1?
« on: November 10, 2008, 04:08:41 PM »
here's why this can happen:

1.) he has plans on kashmir, his team has propped up bill uncle's name as kashmir mediator, and obama is of the opinion that with the kashmir issue solved pakistan can look at the taliban and al qaeda with fresh vigour. well, obviously he has missed out sixty years of pakistani meddling in kashmir and couple of invasions.

2.) he will levy some payment from india on the nuclear deal, what that is we will have to wait and see, maybe weapon inspections or no testing agreement or only US government approved contractors.

3.) he will try to lean on the software and bpo trade to bring jobs back into US, why he can't make his country manufacture clothes and all those GI Joe toys is all chinese to me.

4.) he definitely feels that india and no china is the country to watch out for which could mean caution more than optimism, and therefore inspite his overtures to the indian community his policies towards india may go the other way too of course cloaked in diplomacy which he is good at

the previous democrat government did only one thing for india which was impose sanctions in 1998 and obama is definitely of that school

the coming 12 months are going to be very defining for india 

 
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there is more than meets the i

prfsr

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Re: is obama going to turn into india's enemy no. 1?
« Reply #1 on: November 10, 2008, 05:31:22 PM »
Achu
I do not think you realize that Obama is VERY well-informed. So I do not believe he misses anything.

OTOH his job is to look out for the US, not India. To that extent I do not see him send India any freebies. He also has to listen to the American people - since they elected him.

I am not sure why India should feel entitled to anything, especially IT investments. They went because companies were making money, not as a charity. If India is still feasible, nobody can stop jobs going there.   

I do not understand why Obama should not bring back IT jobs and get people here to manufacture clothes. Who can compete with China there?
It is not upto him anyway - he may increase some additional legislation but he cannot make anybody produce anything.
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dextrous

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Re: is obama going to turn into india's enemy no. 1?
« Reply #2 on: November 11, 2008, 07:28:10 AM »
he could do one of two things
1. tax back for companies that do not outsource
2. higher tax rates for companies that do

though im not convinced what the use would be of protecting non-competetive us industries while wasting tax payer dollars unless he sees long term profits in some industries (something like airbus in europe) in the future which justify spending tax dollars in the current market

then again, the populist thing to do would be to pour in money into failing us auto industry, which has always been a model of failure
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LosingNow

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Re: is obama going to turn into india's enemy no. 1?
« Reply #3 on: November 11, 2008, 07:36:53 AM »

then again, the populist thing to do would be to pour in money into failing us auto industry, which has always been a model of failure
There are 2 auto industries.. the detroit one - that is failing and the southern one - that is doing well.

Honda, Toyota, Nissan etc belong to the southern group.. they directly employ 125K people in the US and have done well .. why not give them the money too..why pick winners and losers ..and penalize those who have done well by keeping costs low and producing quality product that consumers like
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dextrous

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Re: is obama going to turn into india's enemy no. 1?
« Reply #4 on: November 11, 2008, 03:18:47 PM »

then again, the populist thing to do would be to pour in money into failing us auto industry, which has always been a model of failure
There are 2 auto industries.. the detroit one - that is failing and the southern one - that is doing well.

Honda, Toyota, Nissan etc belong to the southern group.. they directly employ 125K people in the US and have done well .. why not give them the money too..why pick winners and losers ..and penalize those who have done well by keeping costs low and producing quality product that consumers like
well, those are collaborations
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CLR James

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Re: is obama going to turn into india's enemy no. 1?
« Reply #5 on: November 11, 2008, 03:58:42 PM »

1. I agree with Pfsr that Obama is highly informed about the world. He is more than aware that Pakistan is a failed state, especially in terms of basic sustaining infrastructures in the North West. This is where he intends to deploy American soft power, in terms of jobs, medication, and education, rather than wholesale grants to the Pakistani military establishment that has been the norm so far. Joe Biden said as much in the vice presidential debate. Ergo, Obama knows that unrestricted military aid to a nuclear equipped failed state with a high Islamicist political component might create another Taliban or infinitely bolster the original one. The Kashmir issue cannot have a wedge status in this scenario because it would only make Islamo-nationalism stronger and go against the grain of empowering liberal voices. Obama, in other words, is not interested in making an Afghanistan out of Pakistan. Overall, I think Obama is committed to a revolutionary schema of reinventing American power through building hegemonic institutions rather than through military enterprises. Economically speaking, the latter is off the table anyways.

2. Well yes, he will play hardball with India in terms of nuclear diplomacy. But then that is only expected. It will proceed in a wink wink nudge nudge fashion, with both parties knowing where exactly the realities lie beyond the rhetoric, in terms of America's moral stance about non proliferation and hard facts about the balance of power in South and South East Asia. Devoting a lot of time and energy to hamper India's civil and military ambitions qua nuclear power simply cannot feature in the US president's agenda in the current scenario.

3. The American president can neither bring back jobs nor send them away. He can, and he will, forge a tax policy that rewards companies that creates jobs in the United States. This in itself is a complex issue. A given company can, and will, continue to ship manufacturing jobs overseas and create other ones in the American metropolitan center, pertaining to high level R & D, management, services, and marketing. The trial will thus be to balance the two. The point therefore is not whether Detroit has to send manufacturing units overseas in order to stay afloat. The point is whether Detroit is hiring thousands of people here in the US to make prototypes for more energy efficient cars, develop the technology, put it into operation, and market it.  The American president can also prompt human and civic infrastructure development that allow businesses to cut costs and flourish. After all, General Motors shipped millions of jobs to Canada a couple of years ago to take advantage of that country's universal health care system.

4. This does not bode well for the rust belt of course. The American small town is dying and nobody can stop that. There can no longer be competitive steel coming out of Pittsburgh; only high tech, precision alloys that do need an army of industrial workers, but more than that, an army of highly trained metallurgists and high investment automation. The yeoman farmer of the American frontier is riding tariff walls and ethanol subsidies into the sunset and he won't be back for the sequel. This is what Sarah Palin never realized: only sixty million, out of a net population of 250, live in her 'Real America'. That America is toast unless it learns to adjust to the new dispensation and allow its progeny to do so.
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LosingNow

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Re: is obama going to turn into india's enemy no. 1?
« Reply #6 on: November 12, 2008, 06:03:28 PM »

then again, the populist thing to do would be to pour in money into failing us auto industry, which has always been a model of failure
There are 2 auto industries.. the detroit one - that is failing and the southern one - that is doing well.

Honda, Toyota, Nissan etc belong to the southern group.. they directly employ 125K people in the US and have done well .. why not give them the money too..why pick winners and losers ..and penalize those who have done well by keeping costs low and producing quality product that consumers like
well, those are collaborations
???
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LosingNow

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Re: is obama going to turn into india's enemy no. 1?
« Reply #7 on: November 12, 2008, 06:07:49 PM »
I think Friedman can be preachy, high-falutin and generalizing ..but this time he makes some sense.

Bottomline: A company that doesnt focus on customers and is looking for government to bailout them out for their chronic mismanagement .. should be allowed to perish or atleast the management should be kicked out
--

November 12, 2008
Op-Ed Columnist
How to Fix a Flat
By THOMAS L. FRIEDMAN
Last September, I was in a hotel room watching CNBC early one morning. They were interviewing Bob Nardelli, the C.E.O. of Chrysler, and he was explaining why the auto industry, at that time, needed $25 billion in loan guarantees. It wasn’t a bailout, he said. It was a way to enable the car companies to retool for innovation. I could not help but shout back at the TV screen: “We have to subsidize Detroit so that it will innovate? What business were you people in other than innovation?” If we give you another $25 billion, will you also do accounting?

How could these companies be so bad for so long? Clearly the combination of a very un-innovative business culture, visionless management and overly generous labor contracts explains a lot of it. It led to a situation whereby General Motors could make money only by selling big, gas-guzzling S.U.V.’s and trucks. Therefore, instead of focusing on making money by innovating around fuel efficiency, productivity and design, G.M. threw way too much energy into lobbying and maneuvering to protect its gas guzzlers.

This included striking special deals with Congress that allowed the Detroit automakers to count the mileage of gas guzzlers as being less than they really were — provided they made some cars flex-fuel capable for ethanol. It included special offers of $1.99-a-gallon gasoline for a year to any customer who purchased a gas guzzler. And it included endless lobbying to block Congress from raising the miles-per-gallon requirements. The result was an industry that became brain dead.

Nothing typified this more than statements like those of Bob Lutz, G.M.’s vice chairman. He has been quoted as saying that hybrids like the Toyota Prius “make no economic sense.” And, in February, D Magazine of Dallas quoted him as saying that global warming “is a total crock of [expletive].”

These are the guys taxpayers are being asked to bail out.

And please, spare me the alligator tears about G.M.’s health care costs. Sure, they are outrageous. “But then why did G.M. refuse to lift a finger to support a national health care program when Hillary Clinton was pushing for it?” asks Dan Becker, a top environmental lobbyist.

Not every automaker is at death’s door. Look at this article that ran two weeks ago on autochannel.com: “ALLISTON, Ontario, Canada — Honda of Canada Mfg. officially opened its newest investment in Canada — a state-of-the art $154 million engine plant. The new facility will produce 200,000 fuel-efficient four-cylinder engines annually for Civic production in response to growing North American demand for vehicles that provide excellent fuel economy.”

The blame for this travesty not only belongs to the auto executives, but must be shared equally with the entire Michigan delegation in the House and Senate, virtually all of whom, year after year, voted however the Detroit automakers and unions instructed them to vote. That shielded General Motors, Ford and Chrysler from environmental concerns, mileage concerns and the full impact of global competition that could have forced Detroit to adapt long ago.

Indeed, if and when they do have to bury Detroit, I hope that all the current and past representatives and senators from Michigan have to serve as pallbearers. And no one has earned the “honor” of chief pallbearer more than the Michigan Representative John Dingell, the chairman of the House Energy and Commerce Committee who is more responsible for protecting Detroit to death than any single legislator.

O.K., now that I have all that off my chest, what do we do? I am as terrified as anyone of the domino effect on industry and workers if G.M. were to collapse. But if we are going to use taxpayer money to rescue Detroit, then it should be done along the lines proposed in The Wall Street Journal on Monday by Paul Ingrassia, a former Detroit bureau chief for that paper.

“In return for any direct government aid,” he wrote, “the board and the management [of G.M.] should go. Shareholders should lose their paltry remaining equity. And a government-appointed receiver — someone hard-nosed and nonpolitical — should have broad power to revamp G.M. with a viable business plan and return it to a private operation as soon as possible. That will mean tearing up existing contracts with unions, dealers and suppliers, closing some operations and selling others and downsizing the company ... Giving G.M. a blank check — which the company and the United Auto Workers union badly want, and which Washington will be tempted to grant — would be an enormous mistake.”

I would add other conditions: Any car company that gets taxpayer money must demonstrate a plan for transforming every vehicle in its fleet to a hybrid-electric engine with flex-fuel capability, so its entire fleet can also run on next generation cellulosic ethanol.

Lastly, somebody ought to call Steve Jobs, who doesn’t need to be bribed to do innovation, and ask him if he’d like to do national service and run a car company for a year. I’d bet it wouldn’t take him much longer than that to come up with the G.M. iCar.


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dextrous

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Re: is obama going to turn into india's enemy no. 1?
« Reply #8 on: November 13, 2008, 12:40:48 AM »

then again, the populist thing to do would be to pour in money into failing us auto industry, which has always been a model of failure
There are 2 auto industries.. the detroit one - that is failing and the southern one - that is doing well.

Honda, Toyota, Nissan etc belong to the southern group.. they directly employ 125K people in the US and have done well .. why not give them the money too..why pick winners and losers ..and penalize those who have done well by keeping costs low and producing quality product that consumers like
well, those are collaborations
???
how are japanese cars considered "american"?
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LosingNow

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Re: is obama going to turn into india's enemy no. 1?
« Reply #9 on: November 13, 2008, 01:57:41 AM »

then again, the populist thing to do would be to pour in money into failing us auto industry, which has always been a model of failure
There are 2 auto industries.. the detroit one - that is failing and the southern one - that is doing well.

Honda, Toyota, Nissan etc belong to the southern group.. they directly employ 125K people in the US and have done well .. why not give them the money too..why pick winners and losers ..and penalize those who have done well by keeping costs low and producing quality product that consumers like
well, those are collaborations
???
how are japanese cars considered "american"?
..because they are made in America
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dextrous

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Re: is obama going to turn into india's enemy no. 1?
« Reply #10 on: November 13, 2008, 02:23:03 AM »

then again, the populist thing to do would be to pour in money into failing us auto industry, which has always been a model of failure
There are 2 auto industries.. the detroit one - that is failing and the southern one - that is doing well.

Honda, Toyota, Nissan etc belong to the southern group.. they directly employ 125K people in the US and have done well .. why not give them the money too..why pick winners and losers ..and penalize those who have done well by keeping costs low and producing quality product that consumers like
well, those are collaborations
???
how are japanese cars considered "american"?
..because they are made in America

eh, i don't agree with your car classifications...made in means nothing in car terms. it is true that some of the toyota vehicles are made almost exclusively in america...and some fords are made in mexico...and some parts are made in america, assembled elsewhere, etc. however, the key thing is that the parent companies are largely based in japan

by "american" i mean companies that are hq-ered in america and cars that are identified as "american" by americans...regardless, depending on the car, some japanese companies use mostly US stuff while some american cars mostly use foreign stuff.



-------------
MAKE/MODEL ASSEMBLY PARTS STATUS
Toyota Sienna USA 85% DOMESTIC
Toyota Camry USA 80% DOMESTIC
Toyota Tundra USA 80% DOMESTIC
Honda Ridgeline USA 75% DOMESTIC
Honda Pilot USA 75% DOMESTIC
Toyota Avalon USA 75% DOMESTIC
Toyota Corolla USA 75% DOMESTIC
Honda Accord USA 70% IMPORT
Honda Civic USA 70% IMPORT
Honda Odyssey USA 70% IMPORT
----------------------------------------
but you still won't hear the gov't talking about bailing out toyota.
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