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AuthorTopic: Is it time for this Maharathi to retire? (non-cricket.. will move to ETC. later)  (Read 1723 times)

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LosingNow

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Good one from rediff today.

--
Please retire, Mr Bachchan!

K S Shekhawat | BS | September 10, 2007 | 13:42 IST

Dear Mr Amitabh Bachchan,

My neighbour said to me the other day that she does not like your movies very much because you always play Amitabh Bachchan essaying a role, that you reduce every role to a caricature of how Amitabh Bachchan would play it. It was all very complicated, and I don't think I would have understood a whit of her excoriating commentary had we not been walking out from a screening of an execrable film called Nishabd.

It's hard to say who was worse in that film-- the twit of a girl you fall in love with (Why? She's so irritating, you want to slap her) or your character as an older man in love with a girl your daughter's age.

Later, I read various people involved with the making of the film saying it had failed at the box office because India wasn't mature enough to accept a Lolita-like tale of love. What they should have said is that it was a disaster because the cast seemed to have no clue how to act.

We, in the print media, run a proofing/editing test when we interview newbies for their first jobs as reporters/sub-editors. Perhaps Nishabd could be used by wannabe actors/directors as a lesson in how not to act/make a film. Still, I said to my friend, everybody is entitled to make a mistake now and then, and maybe Nishabd was yours. Really, retorted my friend, had I forgotten the films you had acted in during the 1980s and perhaps the early 1990s. Actually, I wish I could forget them -- those Mards and Coolies and countless others where you looked in your 40s or 50s but acted like you were in college and, sadly, danced with those eunuch-like steps that you had perfected, repeating yourself in film after film till neither you (surely) nor we could tell one apart from the other.

In all fairness, let me make a disclosure here: I have never been an Amitabh Bachchan fan. There, I've said it, and I haven't been struck by lightning. Yet. True, you had your moments in Sholay and Deewar, and a very nice comic turn in Chupke Chupke, Namak Halal and Amar Akbar Anthony. And, okay, that baritone is to die for.

But in a career spanning three and a half decades, what more do you have to show on your CV? Black? Overacted nonsense, says my friend, though I concede that some may debate the point. My own view? Er, um. Kaun Banega Crorepati? Now there's a benchmark, and for many of us, it marked the transition to what we thought would be a more mature Amitabh Bachchan. You packed in audiences who sat glued to their TVs and quizzing became a national pastime.

Karan Johar turned you into a clotheshorse and you moved into iconic status once again. This was the time to retire gracefully, at a resurrection in your career that superceded your middle age status by far. Alas, you weren't ready to write your requiems yet. You went on to destroy yourself all over again in an echo of the 1980s. Only you weren't getting any younger, and it's difficult to forgive a venerable figure in his dotage.

Okay, you pulled off Sexy Sam in Kabhi Alvida Naa Kehna, but my god, what were you doing dancing in fancy dress surrounded by women in equally strange costumes on railway platforms in Jhoom Barabar Jhoom?

And Ram Gopal Varma Ki Aag (which, after all those reviews and editorials, I'd have to be mad to want to see): it must be asked with due respect to your status and cult following-- whatever made you do it? That the film seems to have succeeded in desecrating several iconic performances in one sweep was bad enough. But how could you allow the memory of your Jai (to Dharmendra's Veeru, in one of Bollywood's most abiding screen friendships) be destroyed by some newcomer whose name no one seems able to remember?

Actually, why am I surprised? Haven't you over-exposed yourself, dancing at weddings and parties? You conducted yourself with great dignity at Abhishek and Aishwarya's nuptials, so it must be asked why you take on the role of dancing (and dancing attendance) at your friends', who seem to be able to rent-a-Bachchan on whimsy?

Even that would be all right if, like ageing mentors in families, you would do a jhatka or matka as a part of the celebrations -- favourite aunts do that too!-- but as the star attraction? Mr Bachchan, your age, your age!

And the ads-- you seem incapable, say my media friends, of saying no to any offer to "act". You say you need the money-- I know, I know, you almost went bankrupt-- but since everyone in the family have fairly stable careers, and you're not doing so badly yourself, surely you don't need to mouth such inanities as Binani Cement, and not Amitabh Bachchan, is the real Big B!

Or is it that you've overlooked that you're no longer young, or even middle-aged, that you're a grandfather, that you need to slow down, and that you absolutely must stop being part of every depressing, tacky production in tinsel town.

You have given Bollywood some excellent moments, some parts in which you have excelled, but as you caricature them now in your old age, it must be said that the sum of those parts does not make for an appealing Amitabh Bachchan. It's time to remove the greasepaint, hang up the boots and retire, Mr Bachchan. And not just for my sake, but for those millions who were once your fans.

Yours etc
K S Shekhawat

http://www.rediff.com/movies/2007/sep/10bs.htm
« Last Edit: September 10, 2007, 09:30:49 PM by kban1 »
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sudzz

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This guy lost me in the third paragraph....
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arjun

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I think he has got a point.
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Libran

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Retirement is a personal decision..... If this guy does not want to watch AB...let him stay away....period

Not that all of AB's movies are good...true, he is seen in too many movies and way too many ads... and the problem of plenty will catch up... but, so do the SRKs of the world....

The only guy in the industry who knows what it takes to maintain the star status is Aamir Khan and the man can act too... ( an understatement )
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Jai

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Retirement is a personal decision..... If this guy does not want to watch AB...let him stay away....period

Not that all of AB's movies are good...true, he is seen in too many movies and way too many ads... and the problem of plenty will catch up... but, so do the SRKs of the world....

The only guy in the industry who knows what it takes to maintain the star status is Aamir Khan and the man can act too... ( an understatement )

I disagree with the last line of your post. If you are talking about 'star status', then it's got to be SRK. Although I have the same grude with SRK that the writer has with AB, they always play themselves in any movie. I am however not talking from 'acting' pov, but purely from 'star status' pov. SRK almost bailed out Yashraj banner with 'Chak De India' in which he didn't play a conventional hero. Aamir has done some really bad films in the past like 'Love Love Love', 'Tum Mere Ho', 'Jawani Zindabad', 'Awal Number', 'Baazi', 'Mann' etc. But to his credit, he took the next step and experimented with his roles and gave us some memorable films. But then I was shocked to see him doing a 'Fanaa'. Anyone but Aamir should have acted in that film. If we talk purely about BO, then check out Akki's career. That guy has hardly given a flop film in the past 2-3 years despite not working with the so called big banners like Subhash Ghai, Yash Chopra, KJo etc. And he also believes in quantities unlike someone like Aamir. Amazing success story I must say.
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Libran

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Retirement is a personal decision..... If this guy does not want to watch AB...let him stay away....period

Not that all of AB's movies are good...true, he is seen in too many movies and way too many ads... and the problem of plenty will catch up... but, so do the SRKs of the world....

The only guy in the industry who knows what it takes to maintain the star status is Aamir Khan and the man can act too... ( an understatement )

I disagree with the last line of your post. If you are talking about 'star status', then it's got to be SRK. Although I have the same grude with SRK that the writer has with AB, they always play themselves in any movie. I am however not talking from 'acting' pov, but purely from 'star status' pov. SRK almost bailed out Yashraj banner with 'Chak De India' in which he didn't play a conventional hero. Aamir has done some really bad films in the past like 'Love Love Love', 'Tum Mere Ho', 'Jawani Zindabad', 'Awal Number', 'Baazi', 'Mann' etc. But to his credit, he took the next step and experimented with his roles and gave us some memorable films. But then I was shocked to see him doing a 'Fanaa'. Anyone but Aamir should have acted in that film. If we talk purely about BO, then check out Akki's career. That guy has hardly given a flop film in the past 2-3 years despite not working with the so called big banners like Subhash Ghai, Yash Chopra, KJo etc. And he also believes in quantities unlike someone like Aamir. Amazing success story I must say.

Maybe I articulated differently....Aamir maintains his status as a star outside of the film circles with a panache that is lacking in both AB and SRK...

No controversies, no dancing for money ... a no nonsense guy... Everyone makes mistakes in chosing bad movies...but it is important that they accept the truth of the outcome and move on....

No one could have given us a RDB, a Lagaan or a Dil Chahta Hai...and what is important here is that Aamir was just one of the characters and not the entire movie unlike an AB or a SRK
........and your point on Akshay Kumar  :icon_thumleft:
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kban1

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are we comparing Akshay "wooden" Kumar to Amir Khan as an actor ??   :nono: :nono:
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Jai

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Retirement is a personal decision..... If this guy does not want to watch AB...let him stay away....period

Not that all of AB's movies are good...true, he is seen in too many movies and way too many ads... and the problem of plenty will catch up... but, so do the SRKs of the world....

The only guy in the industry who knows what it takes to maintain the star status is Aamir Khan and the man can act too... ( an understatement )

I disagree with the last line of your post. If you are talking about 'star status', then it's got to be SRK. Although I have the same grude with SRK that the writer has with AB, they always play themselves in any movie. I am however not talking from 'acting' pov, but purely from 'star status' pov. SRK almost bailed out Yashraj banner with 'Chak De India' in which he didn't play a conventional hero. Aamir has done some really bad films in the past like 'Love Love Love', 'Tum Mere Ho', 'Jawani Zindabad', 'Awal Number', 'Baazi', 'Mann' etc. But to his credit, he took the next step and experimented with his roles and gave us some memorable films. But then I was shocked to see him doing a 'Fanaa'. Anyone but Aamir should have acted in that film. If we talk purely about BO, then check out Akki's career. That guy has hardly given a flop film in the past 2-3 years despite not working with the so called big banners like Subhash Ghai, Yash Chopra, KJo etc. And he also believes in quantities unlike someone like Aamir. Amazing success story I must say.

Maybe I articulated differently....Aamir maintains his status as a star outside of the film circles with a panache that is lacking in both AB and SRK...

No controversies, no dancing for money ... a no nonsense guy... Everyone makes mistakes in chosing bad movies...but it is important that they accept the truth of the outcome and move on....

No one could have given us a RDB, a Lagaan or a Dil Chahta Hai...and what is important here is that Aamir was just one of the characters and not the entire movie unlike an AB or a SRK
........and your point on Akshay Kumar  :icon_thumleft:

Are you sure Aamir stays out of controversy? Not really. I can think of plenty of them in the past couple of years - his comments about the NBA post RDB, his alleged involvement with a gori during the Lagaan days and the rumor of fathering her child, his alleged 'interference' during the film-making (although I agree this issue is kinda blown out of proportion) but he did have some serious issues with the director in charge during the making of his latest film 'Taare Zameen Par', he even has backed out of the film 'Lajjo' co-starring Bebo to be directed by Mani Rathnam due to some differences. I applaud him for not dancing for money (I've no problem with stage shows, but hate the stars dancing at some rich guy's ladlaa beta's wedding).

The three movies that you have mentioned are in my top favorite list along with JJWS. As for SRK, two of my favorites are Kabhi Haan Kabhi Na and Yes Boss. Only SRK can drop the heroine off the terrace (usually Shakti Kapoor's job) and sing 'Tujhe feka toh yeh jaana sanam' and become the biggest star of the country. I think more than his films or acting, I like him for his attitude....I can see bits of SG there.  :D He truly believes 'Yeh baat sach doston...heyy I am the best..I am the Best...I am the best'.
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Libran

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Retirement is a personal decision..... If this guy does not want to watch AB...let him stay away....period

Not that all of AB's movies are good...true, he is seen in too many movies and way too many ads... and the problem of plenty will catch up... but, so do the SRKs of the world....

The only guy in the industry who knows what it takes to maintain the star status is Aamir Khan and the man can act too... ( an understatement )

I disagree with the last line of your post. If you are talking about 'star status', then it's got to be SRK. Although I have the same grude with SRK that the writer has with AB, they always play themselves in any movie. I am however not talking from 'acting' pov, but purely from 'star status' pov. SRK almost bailed out Yashraj banner with 'Chak De India' in which he didn't play a conventional hero. Aamir has done some really bad films in the past like 'Love Love Love', 'Tum Mere Ho', 'Jawani Zindabad', 'Awal Number', 'Baazi', 'Mann' etc. But to his credit, he took the next step and experimented with his roles and gave us some memorable films. But then I was shocked to see him doing a 'Fanaa'. Anyone but Aamir should have acted in that film. If we talk purely about BO, then check out Akki's career. That guy has hardly given a flop film in the past 2-3 years despite not working with the so called big banners like Subhash Ghai, Yash Chopra, KJo etc. And he also believes in quantities unlike someone like Aamir. Amazing success story I must say.

Maybe I articulated differently....Aamir maintains his status as a star outside of the film circles with a panache that is lacking in both AB and SRK...

No controversies, no dancing for money ... a no nonsense guy... Everyone makes mistakes in chosing bad movies...but it is important that they accept the truth of the outcome and move on....

No one could have given us a RDB, a Lagaan or a Dil Chahta Hai...and what is important here is that Aamir was just one of the characters and not the entire movie unlike an AB or a SRK
........and your point on Akshay Kumar  :icon_thumleft:

Are you sure Aamir stays out of controversy? Not really. I can think of plenty of them in the past couple of years - his comments about the NBA post RDB, his alleged involvement with a gori during the Lagaan days and the rumor of fathering her child, his alleged 'interference' during the film-making (although I agree this issue is kinda blown out of proportion) but he did have some serious issues with the director in charge during the making of his latest film 'Taare Zameen Par', he even has backed out of the film 'Lajjo' co-starring Bebo to be directed by Mani Rathnam due to some differences. I applaud him for not dancing for money (I've no problem with stage shows, but hate the stars dancing at some rich guy's ladlaa beta's wedding).

The three movies that you have mentioned are in my top favorite list along with JJWS. As for SRK, two of my favorites are Kabhi Haan Kabhi Na and Yes Boss. Only SRK can drop the heroine off the terrace (usually Shakti Kapoor's job) and sing 'Tujhe feka toh yeh jaana sanam' and become the biggest star of the country. I think more than his films or acting, I like him for his attitude....I can see bits of SG there.  :D He truly believes 'Yeh baat sach doston...heyy I am the best..I am the Best...I am the best'.

If only he could say he is the best w/o the bleating goatish tone....  ;D  ;D
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kban1

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I dont understand this fascination with SRK.

BO hit he may be but I have never seen a more piss poor throwaway of talent (whatever he has).

Comparisons to Amitabh are so way off mark (Bachhan at least has talent and knows how to act, although he is losing it, as LN has pointed out -- delicous turn of events there  ;) )

And Jai, please -- do not denigrate SG by comparing him with SRK. The former makes the most of what he has and goes beyond, the latter is a fluffster pumped up by a juvenile trade media.
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Jai

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are we comparing Akshay "wooden" Kumar to Amir Khan as an actor ??   :nono: :nono:

No. We were talking about 'start status' and I mentioned that Akshay's films have been very successful in the past couple of years. That is a FACT and has nothing to do with him being a 'wooden' or 'plastic' or 'steel' actor. May be he's successful today because he chose films keeping in mind his limitations as an actor.
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Zacked

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Retirement is a personal decision..... If this guy does not want to watch AB...let him stay away....period

Not that all of AB's movies are good...true, he is seen in too many movies and way too many ads... and the problem of plenty will catch up... but, so do the SRKs of the world....

The only guy in the industry who knows what it takes to maintain the star status is Aamir Khan and the man can act too... ( an understatement )

I disagree with the last line of your post. If you are talking about 'star status', then it's got to be SRK. Although I have the same grude with SRK that the writer has with AB, they always play themselves in any movie. I am however not talking from 'acting' pov, but purely from 'star status' pov. SRK almost bailed out Yashraj banner with 'Chak De India' in which he didn't play a conventional hero. Aamir has done some really bad films in the past like 'Love Love Love', 'Tum Mere Ho', 'Jawani Zindabad', 'Awal Number', 'Baazi', 'Mann' etc. But to his credit, he took the next step and experimented with his roles and gave us some memorable films. But then I was shocked to see him doing a 'Fanaa'. Anyone but Aamir should have acted in that film. If we talk purely about BO, then check out Akki's career. That guy has hardly given a flop film in the past 2-3 years despite not working with the so called big banners like Subhash Ghai, Yash Chopra, KJo etc. And he also believes in quantities unlike someone like Aamir. Amazing success story I must say.

Maybe I articulated differently....Aamir maintains his status as a star outside of the film circles with a panache that is lacking in both AB and SRK...

No controversies, no dancing for money ... a no nonsense guy... Everyone makes mistakes in chosing bad movies...but it is important that they accept the truth of the outcome and move on....

No one could have given us a RDB, a Lagaan or a Dil Chahta Hai...and what is important here is that Aamir was just one of the characters and not the entire movie unlike an AB or a SRK
........and your point on Akshay Kumar  :icon_thumleft:

Are you sure Aamir stays out of controversy? Not really. I can think of plenty of them in the past couple of years - his comments about the NBA post RDB, his alleged involvement with a gori during the Lagaan days and the rumor of fathering her child, his alleged 'interference' during the film-making (although I agree this issue is kinda blown out of proportion) but he did have some serious issues with the director in charge during the making of his latest film 'Taare Zameen Par', he even has backed out of the film 'Lajjo' co-starring Bebo to be directed by Mani Rathnam due to some differences. I applaud him for not dancing for money (I've no problem with stage shows, but hate the stars dancing at some rich guy's ladlaa beta's wedding).

The three movies that you have mentioned are in my top favorite list along with JJWS. As for SRK, two of my favorites are Kabhi Haan Kabhi Na and Yes Boss. Only SRK can drop the heroine off the terrace (usually Shakti Kapoor's job) and sing 'Tujhe feka toh yeh jaana sanam' and become the biggest star of the country. I think more than his films or acting, I like him for his attitude....I can see bits of SG there.  :D He truly believes 'Yeh baat sach doston...heyy I am the best..I am the Best...I am the best'.

As per his interview his stint with NBA Happened when he was in delhi and saw some of the guys protesting for NBA... he stood up and asked the poor people to relocate to a different place.. dont think it was controversial but for some of our political party every thing against them is controversial...
abt the fling with firangi its still a rumour... the firangi hasnt yet said anything abt it yet
Regarding the indiference with Amol Gupte he already mentioned in his blog that after seeing the rushes of Taare Zameen Par he wasnt convinced with Amol Gupte as a director and it was Amol himself who asked Aamir Khan to direct it.
And Lajjo it isnt Aamir Khan who is having differences... Its Mani Ratnam and the producer of the movie which has major differences..

Also Lagaan was offered to SRK first... but he didnt have balls to do it and so rejected it.. even RDB if i have not mistaken was offered to SRK n he declined it...

SRK Has loads of talents which can be seen in movies like swades and cdi but IMO he is wasting it...
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Jai

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I dont understand this fascination with SRK.

BO hit he may be but I have never seen a more piss poor throwaway of talent (whatever he has).

Comparisons to Amitabh are so way off mark (Bachhan at least has talent and knows how to act, although he is losing it, as LN has pointed out -- delicous turn of events there  ;) )

And Jai, please -- do not denigrate SG by comparing him with SRK. The former makes the most of what he has and goes beyond, the latter is a fluffster pumped up by a juvenile trade media.

If a clarification is needed, then let me tell you here is that I am not fascinated by SRK or for that matter any other actor. I just go by the film and not by star names. The Hindi films that I've liked in the last couple of years hardly had any big names - films like 'Main Mera Patni Aur Woh', 'Dor', 'Khosla Ka Ghosla', 'Page 3', 'Bheja Fry', 'Metro', 'Haazar Khwaishen Aisi' etc. You may also have noticed that I've listed just two SRK films that I liked and that has more to do with the directors - Kundan Shah and Aziz Mirza. I've liked the duo since their Doordarshan days. I prefer that kind of comedy than the David Dhawan types. And I did compare SG with SRK only on one count - attitude and I stand by it. You may have a very low opinion of SRK and that's alright, but a nobody from Delhi with no filmi background can't rule the industry for over a decade just by fluke or pumped by trade media as you have put it. It's the public that decide the fate of a star, or else every star-puttar will be a star too. Similarly, Akki may be 'wooden' according to you, but probably a very fine piece of wood.  :D The bottomline is one has to have the dum to stick around for so song. As far as who are 'actors' and who are not, it'll always be subject to debate. I don't have very high regard for AB the actor. Yes, he was a huge huge star, but has 'acted' only in a few films. AB could have never played a Ramkrishna Paramhansa or that character in 'Taahader Katha'  that Mithunda played or any of the characters Naseer or Om played in Shyam Benegal's films. He didn't even bother to attempt them. People consider his 'Black' a masterpiece. Have you heard what Naseer had to say about that performance?

PS: will discuss this tomorrow, gotta sleep now.
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LosingNow

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People consider his 'Black' a masterpiece.
Who is that ;D ;D

Can you post Naseer's views on that.. I am really interested. I dont know if I said this earlier, but I think he got his diseases mixed up in Black.. his character was supposed to be suffering from Alzheimer's but he was shaking in the movie like he had Parkinson's (the one Michael J Fox has).
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kban1

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are we comparing Akshay "wooden" Kumar to Amir Khan as an actor ??   :nono: :nono:

No. We were talking about 'start status' and I mentioned that Akshay's films have been very successful in the past couple of years. That is a FACT and has nothing to do with him being a 'wooden' or 'plastic' or 'steel' actor. May be he's successful today because he chose films keeping in mind his limitations as an actor.

And thats precisely my point -- we give too much coverage to the type of crappy movies and crappy actors that Bollywood spawns, just on the basis of BO appeal.

And it ceases me no end that the same middle class audience who supports this level of utter crass in our Bollywood movies will not think twice before walking of a  hollywood or foreign movie if even 1/10th of the same crap were visible therein.

Which just goes on to show that this section fo the audience is perfectly aware of what makes for a good movie / actor, yet love to indulge and encourage such mediocrity (and thats being kind) from Bollywood.

This selective lowering of standards is exactly why we produce a 1000+ movies every year, 990 of which are pure unadulterated trash.

Apologies for the rant.
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LosingNow

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990 of which are pure unadulterated trash.
Did you include "Sivaji" in this list?
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Jai

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Retirement is a personal decision..... If this guy does not want to watch AB...let him stay away....period

Not that all of AB's movies are good...true, he is seen in too many movies and way too many ads... and the problem of plenty will catch up... but, so do the SRKs of the world....

The only guy in the industry who knows what it takes to maintain the star status is Aamir Khan and the man can act too... ( an understatement )

I disagree with the last line of your post. If you are talking about 'star status', then it's got to be SRK. Although I have the same grude with SRK that the writer has with AB, they always play themselves in any movie. I am however not talking from 'acting' pov, but purely from 'star status' pov. SRK almost bailed out Yashraj banner with 'Chak De India' in which he didn't play a conventional hero. Aamir has done some really bad films in the past like 'Love Love Love', 'Tum Mere Ho', 'Jawani Zindabad', 'Awal Number', 'Baazi', 'Mann' etc. But to his credit, he took the next step and experimented with his roles and gave us some memorable films. But then I was shocked to see him doing a 'Fanaa'. Anyone but Aamir should have acted in that film. If we talk purely about BO, then check out Akki's career. That guy has hardly given a flop film in the past 2-3 years despite not working with the so called big banners like Subhash Ghai, Yash Chopra, KJo etc. And he also believes in quantities unlike someone like Aamir. Amazing success story I must say.

Maybe I articulated differently....Aamir maintains his status as a star outside of the film circles with a panache that is lacking in both AB and SRK...

No controversies, no dancing for money ... a no nonsense guy... Everyone makes mistakes in chosing bad movies...but it is important that they accept the truth of the outcome and move on....

No one could have given us a RDB, a Lagaan or a Dil Chahta Hai...and what is important here is that Aamir was just one of the characters and not the entire movie unlike an AB or a SRK
........and your point on Akshay Kumar  :icon_thumleft:

Are you sure Aamir stays out of controversy? Not really. I can think of plenty of them in the past couple of years - his comments about the NBA post RDB, his alleged involvement with a gori during the Lagaan days and the rumor of fathering her child, his alleged 'interference' during the film-making (although I agree this issue is kinda blown out of proportion) but he did have some serious issues with the director in charge during the making of his latest film 'Taare Zameen Par', he even has backed out of the film 'Lajjo' co-starring Bebo to be directed by Mani Rathnam due to some differences. I applaud him for not dancing for money (I've no problem with stage shows, but hate the stars dancing at some rich guy's ladlaa beta's wedding).

The three movies that you have mentioned are in my top favorite list along with JJWS. As for SRK, two of my favorites are Kabhi Haan Kabhi Na and Yes Boss. Only SRK can drop the heroine off the terrace (usually Shakti Kapoor's job) and sing 'Tujhe feka toh yeh jaana sanam' and become the biggest star of the country. I think more than his films or acting, I like him for his attitude....I can see bits of SG there.  :D He truly believes 'Yeh baat sach doston...heyy I am the best..I am the Best...I am the best'.

As per his interview his stint with NBA Happened when he was in delhi and saw some of the guys protesting for NBA... he stood up and asked the poor people to relocate to a different place.. dont think it was controversial but for some of our political party every thing against them is controversial...
abt the fling with firangi its still a rumour... the firangi hasnt yet said anything abt it yet
Regarding the indiference with Amol Gupte he already mentioned in his blog that after seeing the rushes of Taare Zameen Par he wasnt convinced with Amol Gupte as a director and it was Amol himself who asked Aamir Khan to direct it.
And Lajjo it isnt Aamir Khan who is having differences... Its Mani Ratnam and the producer of the movie which has major differences..

Also Lagaan was offered to SRK first... but he didnt have balls to do it and so rejected it.. even RDB if i have not mistaken was offered to SRK n he declined it...

SRK Has loads of talents which can be seen in movies like swades and cdi but IMO he is wasting it...

I mentioned that even Aamir stays in the news, doesn't matter who was right and who was wrong. About each of these incidents, a lot of media coverage was given and there were different versions of each story. I am just stating that, nothing else. I support him completely on the NBA issue and I believe he did the right thing. But at the same time, I can't just say that there was no controversy because there certainly was irrespective of who created it. There were so many stories about Amol, Aamir and that film. So it remained in the news because of that and I just pointed that out. What Aamir says 'now' on his blog doesn't change the fact that there were controversies about the film.
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dextrous

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what is this with dancing at weddings...rent-an-amitabh? he dances at ppls weddings? what?!
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Jai

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People consider his 'Black' a masterpiece.

Who is that ;D ;D

Can you post Naseer's views on that.. I am really interested. I dont know if I said this earlier, but I think he got his diseases mixed up in Black.. his character was supposed to be suffering from Alzheimer's but he was shaking in the movie like he had Parkinson's (the one Michael J Fox has).


Sorry LN, I saw one of his interviews on TV when I was in India during the Feb-March period of this year. I doubt we can find the text version on the net. He didn't have very nice things to say on AB's performance in 'Black'. More than his criticisms, what appealed to me was his guts. While AB received mostly praises (and of course the awards) from aam janta as well as his film industry colleagues, here is one guy who's not afraid to speak his mind against the superstar of the industry.

You can find a bit of Mithunda's opinions on AB from this blog: http://bishwanathghosh.blogspot.com/2006/06/amitabh-is-lucky-superstar.html
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kban1

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If a clarification is needed, then let me tell you here is that I am not fascinated by SRK or for that matter any other actor. I just go by the film and not by star names. The Hindi films that I've liked in the last couple of years hardly had any big names - films like 'Main Mera Patni Aur Woh', 'Dor', 'Khosla Ka Ghosla', 'Page 3', 'Bheja Fry', 'Metro', 'Haazar Khwaishen Aisi' etc. You may also have noticed that I've listed just two SRK films that I liked and that has more to do with the directors - Kundan Shah and Aziz Mirza. I've liked the duo since their Doordarshan days. I prefer that kind of comedy than the David Dhawan types.


Fair enough, do not disagree with you here.

Quote
And I did compare SG with SRK only on one count - attitude and I stand by it. You may have a very low opinion of SRK and that's alright, but a nobody from Delhi with no filmi background can't rule the industry for over a decade just by fluke or pumped by trade media as you have put it. It's the public that decide the fate of a star, or else every star-puttar will be a star too. Similarly, Akki may be 'wooden' according to you, but probably a very fine piece of wood.  ;)   The bottomline is one has to have the dum to stick around for so song.


No, it does not take much dum at all -- disagree completely.

As long as we have audiences (and no, not the uneducated / poor who are looking for paisa wasool, but the educated middle classes who know quite well the difference between good and bad actors/ movies) who encourage such crap, these actors / directors /producers have no reason to change because of all this positive reinforcement to crap that they receive.

In such an atmosphere, it takes dum to go away from the beaten path like a handful of actors have done, not to stick to the crap that gets accepted by an ever forgiving, non discerning audience who selectively and consistently choose to lower the standards.

Quote
As far as who are 'actors' and who are not, it'll always be subject to debate. I don't have very high regard for AB the actor. Yes, he was a huge huge star, but has 'acted' only in a few films. AB could have never played a Ramkrishna Paramhansa or that character in 'Taahader Katha'  that Mithunda played or any of the characters Naseer or Om played in Shyam Benegal's films. He didn't even bother to attempt them. People consider his 'Black' a masterpiece. Have you heard what Naseer had to say about that performance?

Well, I have seen enough of Amitabh's movies where his talent comes to the fore -- not his 80's stuff or the morass of crap he churns out now but movies like Deewar, Sholay, faraar etc. Much much better than SRK, any day.

And Black ? a masterpiece -- a worse piece of * movie has probably not been made in the last several years. So, no, I am with you there.
« Last Edit: September 11, 2007, 07:33:32 AM by kban1 »
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kban1

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LN:

990 of which are pure unadulterated trash.
Did you include "Sivaji" in this list?

I did not see  "Sivaji" and cannot say if it belongs in the 990 list. But honestly, from what I read and have heard, I cannot really envisage how missing it is going to leave a void in my movie watching experience.
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dextrous

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If a clarification is needed, then let me tell you here is that I am not fascinated by SRK or for that matter any other actor. I just go by the film and not by star names. The Hindi films that I've liked in the last couple of years hardly had any big names - films like 'Main Mera Patni Aur Woh', 'Dor', 'Khosla Ka Ghosla', 'Page 3', 'Bheja Fry', 'Metro', 'Haazar Khwaishen Aisi' etc. You may also have noticed that I've listed just two SRK films that I liked and that has more to do with the directors - Kundan Shah and Aziz Mirza. I've liked the duo since their Doordarshan days. I prefer that kind of comedy than the David Dhawan types.


Fair enough, do not disagree with you here.

Quote
And I did compare SG with SRK only on one count - attitude and I stand by it. You may have a very low opinion of SRK and that's alright, but a nobody from Delhi with no filmi background can't rule the industry for over a decade just by fluke or pumped by trade media as you have put it. It's the public that decide the fate of a star, or else every star-puttar will be a star too. Similarly, Akki may be 'wooden' according to you, but probably a very fine piece of wood.  ;)   The bottomline is one has to have the dum to stick around for so song.


No, it does not take much dum at all -- disagree completely.

As long as we have audiences (and no, not the uneducated / poor who are looking for paisa wasool, but the educated middle classes who know quite well the difference between good and bad actors/ movies) who encourage such crap, these actors / directors /producers have no reason to chance because of all this positive reinforcement to crap that they receive.

In such an atmosphere, it takes dum to go away from the beaten path like a handful of actors have done, not to stick to the crap that gets accepted by an ever forgiving, non discerning audience who selectively and consistently choose to lower the standards.

Quote
As far as who are 'actors' and who are not, it'll always be subject to debate. I don't have very high regard for AB the actor. Yes, he was a huge huge star, but has 'acted' only in a few films. AB could have never played a Ramkrishna Paramhansa or that character in 'Taahader Katha'  that Mithunda played or any of the characters Naseer or Om played in Shyam Benegal's films. He didn't even bother to attempt them. People consider his 'Black' a masterpiece. Have you heard what Naseer had to say about that performance?

Well, I have seen enough of Amitabh's movies where his talent comes to the fore -- not his 80's stuff or the morass of crap he churns out now but movies like Deewar, Sholay, faraar etc. Much much better than SRK, any day.

And Black ? a masterpiece -- a worse piece of * movie has probably not been made in the last several years. So, no, I am with you there.

Chill down, you're a mod.  ::Whip::
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keep-it-cool

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SRK and guts?????

The day he accepts an off beat role in a small time / unproven film-maker's film, we can start speaking about guts or dum.

Actually, forget off-beat ... lets get one role first.
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justforkix

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LN:

990 of which are pure unadulterated trash.
Did you include "Sivaji" in this list?

I did not see  "Sivaji" and cannot say if it belongs in the 990 list. But honestly, from what I read and have heard, I cannot really envisage how missing it is going to leave a void in my movie watching experience.

Are we talking about Sivaji the Boss here  ;)
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keep-it-cool

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LN:

990 of which are pure unadulterated trash.
Did you include "Sivaji" in this list?

I did not see  "Sivaji" and cannot say if it belongs in the 990 list. But honestly, from what I read and have heard, I cannot really envisage how missing it is going to leave a void in my movie watching experience.

Are we talking about Sivaji the Boss here  ;)

being made in hindi now, i heard
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Sachin Tendulkar gave the muhurat clap for 'Awwal Number' - that apart, he hasn't done much wrong in the last 20 yrs!

gouravk

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Re: Is it time for this Maharathi to retire? (non-cricket.. will move to ETC. la
« Reply #25 on: September 11, 2007, 07:58:22 AM »
was this movie good, btw ?
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justforkix

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Re: Is it time for this Maharathi to retire? (non-cricket.. will move to ETC. la
« Reply #26 on: September 11, 2007, 08:11:12 AM »
was this movie good, btw ?

It was good or should I say coooooouul  :D :D :D

But not as good as some of the late 80s/early 90s classics  :icon_thumleft:
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vincent

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People consider his 'Black' a masterpiece.
Who is that ;D ;D

Can you post Naseer's views on that.. I am really interested. I dont know if I said this earlier, but I think he got his diseases mixed up in Black.. his character was supposed to be suffering from Alzheimer's but he was shaking in the movie like he had Parkinson's (the one Michael J Fox has).

I see very few Hindi movies a year - may be one or two. I have already expressed my opinion on Black elsewhere on this DG : It is a bad copy of a very good Hollywood movie classic (The Miracle Worker), just as most Bollywood copies are. The role had been changed to a male one to suit AB, where as the true story and the Hollywood movie it is a woman teacher, which makes a lot of sense because of the patience and perseverence the character needs as opposed to a shouting and screaming AB which in real-life would be an absolute waste of time. Moreover, the true story (and the Hollywood movie) have neither Alzheimer's nor Parkinson's. This scene has been copied from another Hollywood movie, the name of which escapes me now.
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Zacked

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BTW WTF is SRK trying to do here... trying to ape Sallu or Hrithik???

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pipsqueak

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are we comparing Akshay "wooden" Kumar to Amir Khan as an actor ??   :nono: :nono:

No. We were talking about 'start status' and I mentioned that Akshay's films have been very successful in the past couple of years. That is a FACT and has nothing to do with him being a 'wooden' or 'plastic' or 'steel' actor. May be he's successful today because he chose films keeping in mind his limitations as an actor.

And thats precisely my point -- we give too much coverage to the type of crappy movies and crappy actors that Bollywood spawns, just on the basis of BO appeal.

And it ceases me no end that the same middle class audience who supports this level of utter crass in our Bollywood movies will not think twice before walking of a  hollywood or foreign movie if even 1/10th of the same crap were visible therein.

Which just goes on to show that this section fo the audience is perfectly aware of what makes for a good movie / actor, yet love to indulge and encourage such mediocrity (and thats being kind) from Bollywood.

This selective lowering of standards is exactly why we produce a 1000+ movies every year, 990 of which are pure unadulterated trash.

Apologies for the rant.

10+ good movies every year? really?
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pipsqueak

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People consider his 'Black' a masterpiece.
Who is that ;D ;D

Can you post Naseer's views on that.. I am really interested. I dont know if I said this earlier, but I think he got his diseases mixed up in Black.. his character was supposed to be suffering from Alzheimer's but he was shaking in the movie like he had Parkinson's (the one Michael J Fox has).

cooooul!

this movie was given to me by a friend who finds my cynical attitude towards most indian movies "snooty" and hates me for it - i stopped watching at half-way point, thinking i had enough of AB's theatrics - he gets a disease and shakes and shivers after that?

...and i thought he was unbearable already!
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gouravk

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Re: Is it time for this Maharathi to retire? (non-cricket.. will move to ETC. la
« Reply #31 on: September 11, 2007, 11:01:22 AM »
hindi films in general have improved dramatically in the last 5 years ...
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caught and bowled

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Re: Is it time for this Maharathi to retire? (non-cricket.. will move to ETC. la
« Reply #32 on: September 11, 2007, 12:12:09 PM »
hindi films in general have improved dramatically in the last 5 years ...

Do you think the Hindi movies have improved, generally speaking? Yes, perhaps in terms of technical finesse, cinematography, editing etc. However the contents remain poor in most of them. Additionally, the vulgarity, the cheapness is absolutely revolting. We have recently installed Sky and with it get a quite a few Indian channels. I have been watching some promos of a new film called Babyy. Earlier had the misfortune of watching promos of Partner and Ramgopal Verma ki ---- mein Aag. All absolutely disgusting.

Similarly, we have had our first sampling of the Hindi serials. If we have people watching such trash and making stars out of people playing in them, God help us.
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LosingNow

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hindi films in general have improved dramatically in the last 5 years ...

Do you think the Hindi movies have improved, generally speaking? Yes, perhaps in terms of technical finesse, cinematography, editing etc. However the contents remain poor in most of them. Additionally, the vulgarity, the cheapness is absolutely revolting. We have recently installed Sky and with it get a quite a few Indian channels. I have been watching some promos of a new film called Babyy. Earlier had the misfortune of watching promos of Partner and Ramgopal Verma ki ---- mein Aag. All absolutely disgusting.

Similarly, we have had our first sampling of the Hindi serials. If we have people watching such trash and making stars out of people playing in them, God help us.
I will agree with gourav that quality has improved ..not dramatically...and as kban said the great majority of movies is still trash.
A few good movies from last few years (and i am not just talking the multiplex genre - Iqbal, Dor, etc) ... Swades, Paheli, Rang De Basanti, Omkara, Lage Raho Munnabhai ..
--
BTW JFK, I hang out with quite a few tamilians in real-life .. they all understand the "sivaji" hype due to fan craze etc..but according to them the movie was total garbage (they were unanimous in that opinion, I have not seen it to form any judgement).
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kban1

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10+ good movies every year? really?

I was being generous
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justforkix

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I will agree with gourav that quality has improved ..not dramatically...and as kban said the great majority of movies is still trash.
A few good movies from last few years (and i am not just talking the multiplex genre - Iqbal, Dor, etc) ... Swades, Paheli, Rang De Basanti, Omkara, Lage Raho Munnabhai ..
--

Improved w.r.t. what is the question ?!? relative to 90s, 80s, 70s, 60s...... Movies in 50s-60s-70s were surely of much higher quality. There are only handful of good movies like the ones you have listed above.

BTW JFK, I hang out with quite a few tamilians in real-life .. they all understand the "sivaji" hype due to fan craze etc..but according to them the movie was total garbage (they were unanimous in that opinion, I have not seen it to form any judgement).

Did they watch it in a big-screen/theater and form this opinion ?!? I think it was good, but nowhere near the classics he dished out in 80s/90s.
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justforkix

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10+ good movies every year? really?

I was being generous

well technically, you only said "990 of which are pure unadulterated trash", which does not mean that the rest of the 10 are good  ::Whip:: ::Whip:: ::Whip::
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kban1

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10+ good movies every year? really?

I was being generous

well technically, you only said "990 of which are pure unadulterated trash", which does not mean that the rest of the 10 are good  ::Whip:: ::Whip:: ::Whip::

Exactly -- the other 10 run the range of poor to good. And I was generous with that estimate  ;D
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pipsqueak

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10+ good movies every year? really?

I was being generous

well technically, you only said "990 of which are pure unadulterated trash", which does not mean that the rest of the 10 are good  ::Whip:: ::Whip:: ::Whip::

Exactly -- the other 10 run the range of poor to good. And I was generous with that estimate  ;D

my estimate would be 1 tolerable movie once every 10 years.
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Jai

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Re: Is it time for this Maharathi to retire? (non-cricket.. will move to ETC. la
« Reply #39 on: September 11, 2007, 03:24:43 PM »
hindi films in general have improved dramatically in the last 5 years ...

Do you think the Hindi movies have improved, generally speaking? Yes, perhaps in terms of technical finesse, cinematography, editing etc. However the contents remain poor in most of them. Additionally, the vulgarity, the cheapness is absolutely revolting. We have recently installed Sky and with it get a quite a few Indian channels. I have been watching some promos of a new film called Babyy. Earlier had the misfortune of watching promos of Partner and Ramgopal Verma ki ---- mein Aag. All absolutely disgusting.

Similarly, we have had our first sampling of the Hindi serials. If we have people watching such trash and making stars out of people playing in them, God help us.

What I like about Hindi films of today are the new directors. Quite a few of them are like breath of fresh air in an industry where KJo, Ghai and Chopras still rule. Names like Dibakar Banerjee, Anurag Basu, Sriram Raghavan, Shimit Amin, Chandan Arora, Sagar Ballary, Onir, Madhur Banderkar etc. I was really impressed with their first effort as a director. But the problem is if not already, soon they'll join a big production house and start compromising on their creativity. I'll anyday watch a small budget film like the ones made by these guys over a film made by Aditya or Yash Chopra or KJo or Suraj Barjatya. I don't think that was possible even five years ago. Can you imagine watching a film like 'Bheja Fry' with Vinay Pathak or 'Main Meri Patni Aur Woh' with Rajpal Yadav or 'Khosla Ka Ghosla' with Pravin Dabbas and Anupam Kher, 'Dor' with Ayesha Takia and Gul Panag five years ago? Nobody would have dared to make a film on a subject like 'My Brother Nikhil' five years ago. And not only that, now there is an audience for these films who appreciate them. As a result, the producers are not incurring losses. In fact they are making money on them. A film like 'Bheja Fry' made on a budget of Rs. 3 crores have already done business of over Rs. 15 crores. So hopefully this experiment will continue. IMO, these are the pluses. But obviously there still will be more craps because of the sheer quantity of films that our industry churn out every year. However, what pisses me off are these so called NRI audiences who still endorse a KJo crap like KANK and make it a hit although the Indian audience had rejected it. As a result, the Chopras and the Johars continue to make films for the NRI audience in which all the familes are affluent Punjabi folks living in mansions celebrating their big fat Punjabi weddings.

About television serials, I stopped watching them more than 10 years ago. After watching gems like 'Chunauti', 'Wagle Ki Duniya', 'Buniyad', 'Nukkad', 'Intezaar', 'Humlog', 'Malgudi Days', 'Zabaan Sambhal Ke', 'Lifeline' etc., I can't watch these craps.
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