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saneguy

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<NON CRIC> Police: our willing executioners
« on: May 06, 2007, 08:08:05 PM »
Police: our willing executioners
Vir Sanghvi

Almost all the decent, well-meaning liberals I know have reacted to the recent revelations about the fake encounters in Gujarat in one of two ways. The first, and more common, response has been to regard the killings as confirmation of the liberal view of Narendra Modi. The victims were Muslims, and they were allegedly murdered by police officers with close links to the chief minister.

The second response has been to argue that even if the link with Modi and his style of governance cannot be sustained, the fact that police officers in any part of India regard it as entirely normal to pull a man off a bus, to murder him in cold blood, and to rape his wife before poisoning her and burning her corpse is shocking.

I agree with both responses. I do not think that it is entirely accidental that the murders took place in Modi’s Gujarat and, yes, of course, it is disgraceful that police officers should behave in this manner.

But here’s my problem: I don’t believe that either response adequately addresses the main issue.

The real problem is not that Modi is a bad man or that the policemen in question behaved badly. It is that the Indian middle class has been content for too long to allow the police force to function as its assassination squad. Few of us have thought through the consequences of our attitude to encounters. If we did, we would recognise that incidents such as the Gujarat murders result inevitably from our readiness to ask our policemen to function as our willing executioners.

Encounters are almost as old as independent India. They began in the 1950s when policemen who were fighting the dacoit menace in the Chambal ravines discovered that the best way to destroy the power of the daku gangs was to murder their leaders. Because dacoits held entire districts in their thrall (a phenomenon celebrated in Hindi cinema from the 1950s to the 1970s), policemen would shoot the outlaws dead and then line up their bodies for villagers to view. Triumphant cops would be photographed with their feet on the heads of dacoits in imitation of pictures of great white hunters and the word would go out: do not be frightened of these thugs; the police will kill them one day.

Though we romanticise the early days of independent India, the truth is that this policy had widespread public sanction even in that era. The political class wanted it known that nobody could escape the power of the Indian state and law-abiding citizens were entirely pleased to see the dacoits shot dead without the inconvenience of the judicial process.

In the 1960s, the same approach was followed in fighting the Naxalites and in combating insurgencies in the Northeast. By the 1970s, police forces in the cow belt regarded it as totally legitimate to shoot mafia leaders dead in bogus encounters. Many will argue that militancy in the Punjab would not have ended without the fake encounters that were the hallmark of the state police’s fight-back against terrorists (the so-called bullet-for-bullet policy) in the 1980s. And by the 1990s, every police force in India was cheerfully bumping off gangsters in cold blood.

Each time the policy of bogus encounters was questioned by human rights activists, the same arguments were trotted out. It was not that the police enjoyed murdering people, we were told. It was that the judicial process was so slow, corrupt and time-consuming that it was almost impossible to bring hardened gangsters to justice. Far easier to just shoot them dead.

Perhaps these arguments were valid when it came to fighting terrorism. But as a means of imposing law and order? Surely, it was not that difficult to persuade judges to deny bail to gangsters? Was it really impossible to find evidence against hardened criminals?

The police claimed that it was. Each time the policy was questioned, they retorted that the inefficiency and corruption of the subordinate judiciary made it impossible to rely on the criminal justice system. Those of us who retorted that the subordinate judiciary was a lot less inefficient and corrupt than the police force itself were drowned in the chorus of middle-class approval. No matter what human rights issues were raised, the middle class remained solidly supportive of the policy of fake encounters.

On the few occasions that there was a public outcry over police murders, it was only about mistaken identity. In the 1990s, the police commissioner of Delhi lost his job after his men shot businessmen dead in a car on Barakhamba Road mistaking them for criminals. The middle class objected to the murder of innocent people. But nobody made the point that any execution on the streets of central Delhi was a travesty of justice. Had the car contained the criminals the police believed it did, then there would have been no problem and no outcry.

Other cases of mistaken identity have rarely caused a stir if the victims have been poor or powerless. A few years ago, the Bombay Police shot a chanawallah dead after mistaking him for a gangster. The papers tried to make a fuss but readers were simply not interested.

Over the last decade, I have written frequently about the dangers posed to society by our tacit encouragement of fake encounters. I have argued that even though the police have the support of the middle class, this policy represents a serious threat to public safety for several reasons.

One: even within various police forces, there is no clarity on the sanctioning of encounters. In Delhi or Calcutta, for instance, it is unlikely that policemen would kill a suspect without informal permission from a very senior officer. But in Bombay, members of a special hit squad (since disbanded) could kill pretty much anyone they wanted without any sanction or accountability. In Bihar and Gujarat, senior officers are unable or unwilling to rein in their trigger-happy juniors.

Can any society afford a policy where any policeman can kill anybody at will and then later claim that the victim was a gangster or a terrorist? And yet, that’s exactly where India is headed.

Two: once you give policemen the licence to kill, you turn them into hitmen for hire. In every single city where encounter specialists have been feted for their murderous skills, these men have gone freelance. Rajbir Singh, the Delhi Police’s encounter specialist, has been accused of working as an enforcer for builders and landlords. (When tenants protested, he threatened to kill them in encounters.)

In Bombay, Dawood Ibrahim has decided that it is cheaper to bribe policemen to kill his rivals than it is to hire gangland hitmen. Senior police officers will tell you about at least two or three IPS officers who were in the pay of the don and murdered his enemies to the rapturous acclaim of a credulous public. Daya Naik, Bombay’s encounter specialist, now faces criminal prosecution over charges that he made millions by renting out his services.

In Gujarat, DG Vanzara, the officer at the centre of the current controversy, has been accused of accepting contracts from dons and some accounts say that he is worth Rs 150 crore, not bad going for a man who was promoted from the ranks.

Three: Narendra Modi’s rivals claim that, in this case, Vanzara was acting at the chief minister’s behest. Even if this is not true — and so far, there is no hard evidence — it is clear that policemen are increasingly functioning as the personal assassins of politicians. In Bombay, for instance, the Shiv Sena government was accused of using the police to wipe out Arun Gawli’s lieutenants when Gawli’s political ambitions posed a threat to the Sena.

Can any democracy tolerate this kind of sanctified political murder?

Four: What worries me the most about the encounter policy is that it is based on class. We, in the middle class, are content to avert our eyes while the police do our dirty work for us — as long as the victims are not people like us. The police recognise this constraint. They know that we will let them do as they wish provided they avoid murdering middle-class people. And so, slum dwellers, poor villagers, landless labourers and those at the fringes of our society live lives that can suddenly be terminated by a police bullet fired at the whim of a sub-inspector. No matter how many of them die unnecessary, unjust deaths, middle class India will refuse to protest or intervene because — and haven’t we heard this many times before? — “there is no alternative to encounters”.

So, while I share the liberal outrage over the Gujarat killings, and I hope that the murderers are brought to justice, I do not believe that this will be enough. As long as the middle class treats the police force as its assassins of choice, there will be more Gujarats, more murders, more rapes and more injustice.

Unless of course we treat this case as a wake-up call, and not as an isolated instance of police excess. Because even if Vanzara did pull the trigger, he acted at our behest. We were the people who gave him his gun — and we gave him his licence to kill.

http://www.hindustantimes.com/StoryPage/FullcoverageStoryPage.aspx?id=d5df7d4d-f044-4681-b526-ac955b8dfceecopsandencounters_Special&&Headline=Police%3a+our+willing+executioners

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kban1

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Re: <NON CRIC> Police: our willing executioners
« Reply #1 on: May 06, 2007, 08:14:26 PM »
Excellent article, some incisive points made by Vir Sanghvi

Thanks for posting saneguy
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TheWall

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Re: <NON CRIC> Police: our willing executioners
« Reply #2 on: May 07, 2007, 04:55:16 PM »
Quote
The real problem is not that Modi is a bad man or that the policemen in question behaved badly. It is that the Indian middle class has been content for too long to allow the police force to function as its assassination squad. Few of us have thought through the consequences of our attitude to encounters. If we did, we would recognise that incidents such as the Gujarat murders result inevitably from our readiness to ask our policemen to function as our willing executioners.

Thanks for posting saneguy. The article is a much needed one.

I think Sanghvi's analysis stops short of nailing the real problem. The problem isn't that the middle class is actually conscious of its role as backers of the police.  Or conscious of its silence. That would be attributing to them ability they don't possess. He assumes the people are capable of thought but are choosing to avoid it or arriving at the wrong conclusions just so they can continue their fairyland existence. In reality, not just the middle class, but the Indian people itself do not display a developed thought-power. We are really asking people to think on elevated lines, while the majority are incapable of that, and the general climate does not provide an environment to cultivate the faculty either.

As an example, how many on this forum, prior to living in this country, had concrete, formed notions of many things we now believe in, express routinely? Take for ex, the 'I'll defend your right to speech, even if I disagree with it'...  Many in India may practice this in their lives, but without consciously formulating the thought/principle. In my case, this particular ideal as well as many others only blossomed forth after living here in the US. Its not that this country inculcated new values but just that latent notions are allowed to mentally form themselves thanks to the general climate around. I'm guessing this is the case with most others on this forum. When you consider that many of us have got as good an 'education' as India could provide, it tells me that there must be something missing in our environment if our mental faculties widen only after leaving India. (Okay, these days you dont have to leave, there is the net and then increasing foreign travel). 

Based on this, I think whats called for are broad-based attempts to increase the thinking ability/interest or thought-power (or whatever you call it) in the Indian masses. An automatic result of a more thinking citizenry will be opposing the ills as one being dealt with in the article. Otherwise, you will be left at arguing whether criminals can actually be brought to justice because the police is equally or more corrupt than the lower judiciary, so as an aam aadmi shouldn't i just be wishing for my safety, which means someone killing criminals even if some innocents die? you'll never be able to convince the broader population on that one, cos the ability to think is under-developed.
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feverpitch

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Re: <NON CRIC> Police: our willing executioners
« Reply #3 on: May 08, 2007, 02:29:58 AM »
Quote
The real problem is not that Modi is a bad man or that the policemen in question behaved badly. It is that the Indian middle class has been content for too long to allow the police force to function as its assassination squad. Few of us have thought through the consequences of our attitude to encounters. If we did, we would recognise that incidents such as the Gujarat murders result inevitably from our readiness to ask our policemen to function as our willing executioners.

Thanks for posting saneguy. The article is a much needed one.
I think Sanghvi's analysis stops short of nailing the real problem. The problem isn't that the middle class is actually conscious of its role as backers of the police.  Or conscious of its silence. That would be attributing to them ability they don't possess. He assumes the people are capable of thought but are choosing to avoid it or arriving at the wrong conclusions just so they can continue their fairyland existence. In reality, not just the middle class, but the Indian people itself do not display a developed thought-power. We are really asking people to think on elevated lines, while the majority are incapable of that, and the general climate does not provide an environment to cultivate the faculty either.


The highlights are what lead to charges of pomposity.

The ones I am bringing against you. Now!

And then, you go on assuming I or others don't reason. Have no ability to think. Strange you insist on others being this way. Consider for yourself this thing a bit more carefully.

As an example, how many on this forum, prior to living in this country, had concrete, formed notions of many things we now believe in, express routinely? Take for ex, the 'I'll defend your right to speech, even if I disagree with it'...  Many in India may practice this in their lives, but without consciously formulating the thought/principle.


[Do] not get carried away by what you discover each day. Its possible many more have done that already. Its possible there is much you will discover in the future that will put your earlier discoveries in perspective.

In my case, this particular ideal as well as many others only blossomed forth after living here in the US. Its not that this country inculcated new values but just that latent notions are allowed to mentally form themselves thanks to the general climate around. I'm guessing this is the case with most others on this forum.


Fellow DGians,

Take a look at this 'new-values, US climate' etc rant... what does he know about me, my education, where my value system lies, etc?

And whats the point of 'provoking' folks here? He really thinks he's brewing a revolution here? Is this the first stage of discovery.... adolescence? (and no, I'm not in the final stages, cynicism)

When you consider that many of us have got as good an 'education' as India could provide, it tells me that there must be something missing in our environment if our mental faculties widen only after leaving India. (Okay, these days you dont have to leave, there is the net and then increasing foreign travel).
Based on this, I think whats called for are broad-based attempts to increase the thinking ability/interest or thought-power (or whatever you call it) in the Indian masses.   


So whats the solution TheWall? How do you propose to "increase the thinking ability/interest or thought-power (or whatever you call it) in the Indian masses"? Please also dig up articles that suggest new ways of doing things as a viable alternative.

An automatic result of a more thinking citizenry will be opposing the ills as one being dealt with in the article. Otherwise, you will be left at arguing whether criminals can actually be brought to justice because the police is equally or more corrupt than the lower judiciary, so as an aam aadmi shouldn't i just be wishing for my safety, which means someone killing criminals even if some innocents die? you'll never be able to convince the broader population on that one, cos the ability to think is under-developed.


I don't even know where to start with this!  People can and do have 'alternate' views, people resonate with higher ideals, people do something about it too. Instead of complaining about aam admi and their under-developed thinking!

Let me end by saying more change will happen in this world by embodying qualities of absolute value [for an explanation on this expression, ask TheWall; ref: http://www.cricketvoice.com/cricketforum2/index.php?topic=10238.msg129472#msg129472] and embarking on a course of action from there, than any amount of agitated action. And certainly much more than just agitated inaction. I mean think about this: a DG member will wonder who on Earth, if he cares so deeply about this place, will waste time on this rather limited-use, time-wasting forum? Aren't we in a race against time to actually fix stuff out there? And you expect us to take you way more seriously than we do, under such conditions!


And, Dravid bhaiyya, while you are at it, do try responding to http://www.cricketvoice.com/cricketforum2/index.php?topic=10238.msg129583#msg129583.

« Last Edit: May 08, 2007, 02:37:48 AM by feverpitch »
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Cernunnos

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Re: <NON CRIC> Police: our willing executioners
« Reply #4 on: May 08, 2007, 02:37:29 AM »
Quote
The real problem is not that Modi is a bad man or that the policemen in question behaved badly. It is that the Indian middle class has been content for too long to allow the police force to function as its assassination squad. Few of us have thought through the consequences of our attitude to encounters. If we did, we would recognise that incidents such as the Gujarat murders result inevitably from our readiness to ask our policemen to function as our willing executioners.

Thanks for posting saneguy. The article is a much needed one.
I think Sanghvi's analysis stops short of nailing the real problem. The problem isn't that the middle class is actually conscious of its role as backers of the police.  Or conscious of its silence. That would be attributing to them ability they don't possess. He assumes the people are capable of thought but are choosing to avoid it or arriving at the wrong conclusions just so they can continue their fairyland existence. In reality, not just the middle class, but the Indian people itself do not display a developed thought-power. We are really asking people to think on elevated lines, while the majority are incapable of that, and the general climate does not provide an environment to cultivate the faculty either.


The highlights are what lead to charges of pomposity.

The ones I am bringing against you. Now!

And then, you go on assuming I or others don't reason. Have no ability to think. Strange you insist on others being this way. Consider for yourself this thing a bit more carefully.

As an example, how many on this forum, prior to living in this country, had concrete, formed notions of many things we now believe in, express routinely? Take for ex, the 'I'll defend your right to speech, even if I disagree with it'...  Many in India may practice this in their lives, but without consciously formulating the thought/principle.


[Do] not get carried away by what you discover each day. Its possible many more have done that already. Its possible there is much you will discover in the future that will put your earlier discoveries in perspective.

In my case, this particular ideal as well as many others only blossomed forth after living here in the US. Its not that this country inculcated new values but just that latent notions are allowed to mentally form themselves thanks to the general climate around. I'm guessing this is the case with most others on this forum.


Fellow DGians,

Take a look at this 'new-values, US climate' etc rant... what does he know about me, my education, where my value system lies, etc?

And whats the point of 'provoking' folks here? He really thinks he's brewing a revolution here? Is this the first stage of discovery.... adolescence? (and no, I'm not in the final stages, cynicism)

When you consider that many of us have got as good an 'education' as India could provide, it tells me that there must be something missing in our environment if our mental faculties widen only after leaving India. (Okay, these days you dont have to leave, there is the net and then increasing foreign travel).
Based on this, I think whats called for are broad-based attempts to increase the thinking ability/interest or thought-power (or whatever you call it) in the Indian masses.   


So whats the solution TheWall? How do you propose to "increase the thinking ability/interest or thought-power (or whatever you call it) in the Indian masses"? Please also dig up articles that suggest new ways of doing things as a viable alternative.

An automatic result of a more thinking citizenry will be opposing the ills as one being dealt with in the article. Otherwise, you will be left at arguing whether criminals can actually be brought to justice because the police is equally or more corrupt than the lower judiciary, so as an aam aadmi shouldn't i just be wishing for my safety, which means someone killing criminals even if some innocents die? you'll never be able to convince the broader population on that one, cos the ability to think is under-developed.


I don't even know where to start with this!  People can and do have 'alternate' views, people resonate with higher ideals, people do something about it too. Instead of complaining about aam admi and their under-developed thinking!

Let me end by saying more change will happen in this world by embodying qualities of absolute value [for an explaination on this expression, ask TheWall; ref: http://www.cricketvoice.com/cricketforum2/index.php?topic=10238.msg129472#msg129472] and embarking on a course of action from there, than any amount of agitated action. And certainly much more than just agitated inaction. I mean think about this: a DG member will wonder who on Earth, if he cares so deeply about this place, will waste time on this rather limited-use, time-wasting forum? Aren't we in a race against time to actually fix stuff out there? And you expect us to take you way more seriously than we do, under such conditions!



 :notworthy: :notworthy:
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feverpitch

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Re: <NON CRIC> Police: our willing executioners
« Reply #5 on: May 08, 2007, 02:40:18 AM »


Cerrnu,

I'm always the humble learner/student/plagiarizer. You need to practice your bowing to authority at the feet of the Wailing Wall, if you are looking for divine knowledge.

 ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
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"In societies where modern conditions of production prevail, all life presents as an immense accumulation of spectacles. Everything that was directly lived has moved away into a representation."

Guy Debord, The Society of the Spectacle

kban1

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Re: <NON CRIC> Police: our willing executioners
« Reply #6 on: May 08, 2007, 02:44:52 AM »
ROFL

 ;D ;D ;D
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pipsqueak

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Re: <NON CRIC> Police: our willing executioners
« Reply #7 on: May 08, 2007, 02:57:05 AM »
FP,

tut, tut!

you just proved that "we indians" cannot think on our own and blossom only when exposed to an environment conducive to developing our mental faculty as this DG. here, we expand our thoughts and copy the great idea(l)s formed by the superior beings.

 ;D  ;D  ;D
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TheWall

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Re: <NON CRIC> Police: our willing executioners
« Reply #8 on: May 08, 2007, 05:31:27 AM »
If copy-pasting were wisdom, the world would be enlightened in a day and we'd have no more of these debates.   ;D
I know you dont think much of originality, but please, for the sake of the nation you seem to care about, embody some it.

Copying will get you some place, like the US, but never to the top  :icon_thumleft:
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TheWall

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Re: <NON CRIC> Police: our willing executioners
« Reply #9 on: May 08, 2007, 05:35:57 AM »
ROFL

 ;D ;D ;D

Thats the best you can do you vindictive stud?  ;)
If your posts are any indication, you are still rolling on the floor... please dont hurt yourself. Thats a desperate plea, not a threat.  ;D
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TheWall

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Re: <NON CRIC> Police: our willing executioners
« Reply #10 on: May 08, 2007, 05:38:59 AM »
FP,

tut, tut!

you just proved that "we indians" cannot think on our own and blossom only when exposed to an environment conducive to developing our mental faculty as this DG. here, we expand our thoughts and copy the great idea(l)s formed by the superior beings.

 ;D  ;D  ;D

And you wench, it seems like I pricked your ego at some point. Sorry about that. I'll learn to be careful with fragile things going forward.

Back to the topic, just to clarify, not necessarily all Indians are as brilliant as you are...evolving into a blossomed intellect within her own vacuum...
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colonel

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Re: <NON CRIC> Police: our willing executioners
« Reply #11 on: May 08, 2007, 05:39:31 AM »
If copy-pasting were wisdom, the world would be enlightened in a day and we'd have no more of these debates.   ;D
I know you dont think much of originality, but please, for the sake of the nation you seem to care about, embody some it.

Copying will get you some place, like the US, but never to the top  :icon_thumleft:

On the contrary, there is something called a pastiche. For the first time, however, I see this rhetoric device being used to do a great hack job on an otherwise decent post.  ;D ;D
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fineleg

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Re: <NON CRIC> Police: our willing executioners
« Reply #12 on: May 08, 2007, 05:41:35 AM »
The Wall,
Learn something man. With a moniker like yours, you are NEVER, repeat , NEVER going to find any of the Gangulians miss an opportunity to put you down no matter the topic is finance, society or cricket. Happens all the time! Its called ganging gangulianing up on someone...favorite pasttime. :icon_thumleft:

I told you stop explaining yourself to FP - but now I've figured u get a certain pleasure in arguing, so sure go ahead. But remember the above "repeat".


PS: SG brought in and sgusa's theory vindicated ::kingkong::
« Last Edit: May 08, 2007, 05:44:38 AM by fineleg »
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TheWall

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Re: <NON CRIC> Police: our willing executioners
« Reply #13 on: May 08, 2007, 05:48:56 AM »
If copy-pasting were wisdom, the world would be enlightened in a day and we'd have no more of these debates.   ;D
I know you dont think much of originality, but please, for the sake of the nation you seem to care about, embody some it.

Copying will get you some place, like the US, but never to the top  :icon_thumleft:

On the contrary, there is something called a pastiche. For the first time, however, I see this rhetoric device being used to do a great hack job on an otherwise decent post.  ;D ;D

as some dude said about modern art, you first prove yourself capable of art, then you get the right to pass off any crap as modern art. once FB puts out something making sense, of his own - thats the catch - he can have all the pasture..pastich ...whatever it is he wants...
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TheWall

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Re: <NON CRIC> Police: our willing executioners
« Reply #14 on: May 08, 2007, 05:51:34 AM »
The Wall,
Learn something man. With a moniker like yours, you are NEVER, repeat , NEVER going to find any of the Gangulians miss an opportunity to put you down no matter the topic is finance, society or cricket. Happens all the time! Its called ganging gangulianing up on someone...favorite pasttime. :icon_thumleft:

I told you stop explaining yourself to FP - but now I've figured u get a certain pleasure in arguing, so sure go ahead. But remember the above "repeat".


PS: SG brought in and sgusa's theory vindicated ::kingkong::

I must admit I thought you were exaggerating... no longer so  ;D

Little did I realise that the unoriginal, the old and the weak alike would have been offended enough to gang up on me  ;)
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colonel

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Re: <NON CRIC> Police: our willing executioners
« Reply #15 on: May 08, 2007, 05:55:41 AM »
If copy-pasting were wisdom, the world would be enlightened in a day and we'd have no more of these debates.   ;D
I know you dont think much of originality, but please, for the sake of the nation you seem to care about, embody some it.

Copying will get you some place, like the US, but never to the top  :icon_thumleft:

On the contrary, there is something called a pastiche. For the first time, however, I see this rhetoric device being used to do a great hack job on an otherwise decent post.  ;D ;D

as some dude said about modern art, you first prove yourself capable of art, then you get the right to pass off any crap as modern art. once FB puts out something making sense, of his own - thats the catch - he can have all the pasture..pastich ...whatever it is he wants...

Aah, you are talking about the credibility of the message; I was simply appreciating the form in which it was put. FL will tell you it is yet another example of Gangulians forming a mutual admiration society, and so be it. Incidentally, are you pissed?
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colonel

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Re: <NON CRIC> Police: our willing executioners
« Reply #16 on: May 08, 2007, 05:57:26 AM »
I see you have had no trouble in believing FL. That, if anything, should be a highlight of his DG existence.
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fineleg

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Re: <NON CRIC> Police: our willing executioners
« Reply #17 on: May 08, 2007, 05:59:38 AM »
The Wall,
Learn something man. With a moniker like yours, you are NEVER, repeat , NEVER going to find any of the Gangulians miss an opportunity to put you down no matter the topic is finance, society or cricket. Happens all the time! Its called ganging gangulianing up on someone...favorite pasttime. :icon_thumleft:

I told you stop explaining yourself to FP - but now I've figured u get a certain pleasure in arguing, so sure go ahead. But remember the above "repeat".


PS: SG brought in and sgusa's theory vindicated ::kingkong::

I must admit I thought you were exaggerating... no longer so  ;D

Little did I realise that the unoriginal, the old and the weak alike would have been offended enough to gang up on me  ;)

You did not hate GC with all your guts (doesn't matter if you disliked him a little or more than little - did you plain burning hate him?) No.

Thats more than enough to offend many here. And, they will remember that you did not hate GC forever now.
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fineleg

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Re: <NON CRIC> Police: our willing executioners
« Reply #18 on: May 08, 2007, 06:02:32 AM »
I see you have had no trouble in believing FL. That, if anything, should be a highlight of his DG existence.

Colonel,
Gangulianing up on me is not a new thing for me. I've had more than my share of battle scars and wear them proud.

You joining in maybe a bit new, but I've dealt with your roommate, you can't be that difficult  :icon_jokercolor:
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colonel

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Re: <NON CRIC> Police: our willing executioners
« Reply #19 on: May 08, 2007, 06:07:01 AM »
I see you have had no trouble in believing FL. That, if anything, should be a highlight of his DG existence.

Colonel,
Gangulianing up on me is not a new thing for me. I've had more than my share of battle scars and wear them proud.

You joining in maybe a bit new, but I've dealt with your roommate, you can't be that difficult  :icon_jokercolor:

Compared to him, I'm as soft as margerine. But tell me, have I taken you on before? And Cernunnos or myself appreciating fever's hack job may have other reasons beyond the Ganguly divide. Why bring that in?
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fineleg

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Re: <NON CRIC> Police: our willing executioners
« Reply #20 on: May 08, 2007, 06:09:30 AM »
I see you have had no trouble in believing FL. That, if anything, should be a highlight of his DG existence.

Colonel,
Gangulianing up on me is not a new thing for me. I've had more than my share of battle scars and wear them proud.

You joining in maybe a bit new, but I've dealt with your roommate, you can't be that difficult  :icon_jokercolor:

Compared to him, I'm as soft as margerine. But tell me, have I taken you on before? And Cernunnos or myself appreciating fever's hack job may have other reasons beyond the Ganguly divide.

No, you haven't (maybe in the ancient past, but nothing I can recollect). Thats why I said above "maybe a bit new". Your appreciating the hack job, sure, it may have more to do with other reasons.

But, there are a few (not necessarily *you*) who jump in to find a small opening and try to defend FP and ridicule the "dravidian"...I dont think it is anything to do with "FP's point of view" support alone. Its gotta do with which side of the "divide".
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kban1

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Re: <NON CRIC> Police: our willing executioners
« Reply #21 on: May 08, 2007, 06:12:51 AM »
Quote
Thats the best you can do you vindictive stud?   ;)
If your posts are any indication, you are still rolling on the floor... please dont hurt yourself. Thats a desperate plea, not a threat.   ;D

LOL, looks like you, the Wall, are more like the Wall of Jericho than the Wall we have come to associate with Dravid (a thousand apologies for the misdirected reference in the past).

Seriously dude, you take yourself way too seriously or arrogate yourself too much importance to the effect that a simple expression of humor at another person's post puts a pinprick in your enormously and perhaps exaggeratedly overblown ego.

Its a DG, chill mate.

Nobody is ganging up on you --  as a cyber entity, you or anyone else on this DG are simply not that important, period.

There are posts which you make and have made that have been duly credited and praised and funny posts made by others, even at the cost of a pinprick or 3 to your Highness' ego are similarly being appreciated here.

Peace and keep on posting  ::cheers::
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TheWall

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Re: <NON CRIC> Police: our willing executioners
« Reply #22 on: May 08, 2007, 06:16:35 AM »

And, Dravid bhaiyya, while you are at it, do try responding to http://www.cricketvoice.com/cricketforum2/index.php?topic=10238.msg129583#msg129583.



Please don't nag men like this. If a man does not respond, and esp if a group of them dont respond, you must get that they dont think your post is woth responding to. Refrain from creating ackwardness by seeking attention and nagging. Swallow it like a ......  ;)
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TheWall

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Re: <NON CRIC> Police: our willing executioners
« Reply #23 on: May 08, 2007, 06:19:36 AM »
Quote
Thats the best you can do you vindictive stud?   ;)
If your posts are any indication, you are still rolling on the floor... please dont hurt yourself. Thats a desperate plea, not a threat.   ;D

LOL, looks like you, the Wall, are more like the Wall of Jericho than the Wall we have come to associate with Dravid (a thousand apologies for the misdirected reference in the past).

Seriously dude, you take yourself way too seriously or arrogate yourself too much importance to the effect that a simple expression of humor at another person's post puts a pinprick in your enormously and perhaps exaggeratedly overblown ego.

Its a DG, chill mate.

Nobody is ganging up on you --  as a cyber entity, you or anyone else on this DG are simply not that important, period.

There are posts which you make and have made that have been duly credited and praised and funny posts made by others, even at the cost of a pinprick or 3 to your Highness' ego are similarly being appreciated here.

Peace and keep on posting  ::cheers::

paint it the color you want... i'm sorry for pricking your ego in the past. (you've stopped rolling i hope?)  :)
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fineleg

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Re: <NON CRIC> Police: our willing executioners
« Reply #24 on: May 08, 2007, 06:20:33 AM »

And, Dravid bhaiyya, while you are at it, do try responding to http://www.cricketvoice.com/cricketforum2/index.php?topic=10238.msg129583#msg129583.



Please don't nag men like this. If a man does not respond, and esp if a group of them dont respond, you must get that they dont think your post is woth responding to. Refrain from creating ackwardness by seeking attention and nagging. Swallow it like a ......  ;)


That was like swell ::cheers:: ::cheers:: ::cheers::
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TheWall

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Re: <NON CRIC> Police: our willing executioners
« Reply #25 on: May 08, 2007, 06:24:00 AM »
The Wall,
Learn something man. With a moniker like yours, you are NEVER, repeat , NEVER going to find any of the Gangulians miss an opportunity to put you down no matter the topic is finance, society or cricket. Happens all the time! Its called ganging gangulianing up on someone...favorite pasttime. :icon_thumleft:

I told you stop explaining yourself to FP - but now I've figured u get a certain pleasure in arguing, so sure go ahead. But remember the above "repeat".


PS: SG brought in and sgusa's theory vindicated ::kingkong::

I must admit I thought you were exaggerating... no longer so  ;D

Little did I realise that the unoriginal, the old and the weak alike would have been offended enough to gang up on me  ;)

You did not hate GC with all your guts (doesn't matter if you disliked him a little or more than little - did you plain burning hate him?) No.

Thats more than enough to offend many here. And, they will remember that you did not hate GC forever now.

Since there was no mention of Ganguly or GC in this thread... I assumed it was safe ground. Apparently not.

As to not wanting to skin GC alive,  its my parents fault. They are from the southern India.  ;D
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fineleg

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Re: <NON CRIC> Police: our willing executioners
« Reply #26 on: May 08, 2007, 06:25:09 AM »
The Wall,
Learn something man. With a moniker like yours, you are NEVER, repeat , NEVER going to find any of the Gangulians miss an opportunity to put you down no matter the topic is finance, society or cricket. Happens all the time! Its called ganging gangulianing up on someone...favorite pasttime. :icon_thumleft:

I told you stop explaining yourself to FP - but now I've figured u get a certain pleasure in arguing, so sure go ahead. But remember the above "repeat".


PS: SG brought in and sgusa's theory vindicated ::kingkong::

I must admit I thought you were exaggerating... no longer so  ;D

Little did I realise that the unoriginal, the old and the weak alike would have been offended enough to gang up on me  ;)

You did not hate GC with all your guts (doesn't matter if you disliked him a little or more than little - did you plain burning hate him?) No.

Thats more than enough to offend many here. And, they will remember that you did not hate GC forever now.

Since there was no mention of Ganguly or GC in this thread... I assumed it was safe ground. Apparently not.

As to not wanting to skin GC alive,  its my parents fault. They are from the southern India.  ;D

Well, you learnt a lesson that others have learnt the hard way as well  :icon_jokercolor:
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TheWall

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Re: <NON CRIC> Police: our willing executioners
« Reply #27 on: May 08, 2007, 06:26:41 AM »

And, Dravid bhaiyya, while you are at it, do try responding to http://www.cricketvoice.com/cricketforum2/index.php?topic=10238.msg129583#msg129583.



Please don't nag men like this. If a man does not respond, and esp if a group of them dont respond, you must get that they dont think your post is woth responding to. Refrain from creating ackwardness by seeking attention and nagging. Swallow it like a ......  ;)


That was like swell ::cheers:: ::cheers:: ::cheers::


Hey, a man's gotto say 'nuff at some point right  ::cheers::  ::cheers::
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kban1

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Re: <NON CRIC> Police: our willing executioners
« Reply #28 on: May 08, 2007, 06:27:53 AM »
Quote
paint it the color you want... i'm sorry for pricking your ego in the past. (you've stopped rolling i hope?)  


Nah, I'm still rolling, your well intentoned post notwithstanding. Its funny that for whatever reason (probably your past exchanges with FP), you are making a mountain out of a molehill.

And it has nothing to do with my ego -- far more people and with far fiercer arsenals than you have tried the prick routine and it has not worked. Seriously, and I mean it - dont read too much into it.

peace



 
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TheWall

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Re: <NON CRIC> Police: our willing executioners
« Reply #29 on: May 08, 2007, 06:31:00 AM »
The Wall,
Learn something man. With a moniker like yours, you are NEVER, repeat , NEVER going to find any of the Gangulians miss an opportunity to put you down no matter the topic is finance, society or cricket. Happens all the time! Its called ganging gangulianing up on someone...favorite pasttime. :icon_thumleft:

I told you stop explaining yourself to FP - but now I've figured u get a certain pleasure in arguing, so sure go ahead. But remember the above "repeat".


PS: SG brought in and sgusa's theory vindicated ::kingkong::

I must admit I thought you were exaggerating... no longer so  ;D

Little did I realise that the unoriginal, the old and the weak alike would have been offended enough to gang up on me  ;)

You did not hate GC with all your guts (doesn't matter if you disliked him a little or more than little - did you plain burning hate him?) No.

Thats more than enough to offend many here. And, they will remember that you did not hate GC forever now.

Since there was no mention of Ganguly or GC in this thread... I assumed it was safe ground. Apparently not.

As to not wanting to skin GC alive,  its my parents fault. They are from the southern India.  ;D

Well, you learnt a lesson that others have learnt the hard way as well  :icon_jokercolor:

seriously dude... what an ambush! talk about pre-emptive action.
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TheWall

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Re: <NON CRIC> Police: our willing executioners
« Reply #30 on: May 08, 2007, 06:34:04 AM »
Quote
paint it the color you want... i'm sorry for pricking your ego in the past. (you've stopped rolling i hope?)   


Nah, I'm still rolling, your well intentoned post notwithstanding. Its funny that for whatever reason (probably your past exchanges with FP), you are making a mountain out of a molehill.

And it has nothing to do with my ego -- far more people and with far fiercer arsenals than you have tried the prick routine and it has not worked. Seriously, and I mean it - dont read too much into it.

peace 

peace. i hear you.

(but if i were FP, i'd be attacking even now, cos its the American corporate trait to attack,attack,attack.).
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pipsqueak

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Re: <NON CRIC> Police: our willing executioners
« Reply #31 on: May 08, 2007, 07:28:43 AM »
FP,

tut, tut!

you just proved that "we indians" cannot think on our own and blossom only when exposed to an environment conducive to developing our mental faculty as this DG. here, we expand our thoughts and copy the great idea(l)s formed by the superior beings.

 ;D  ;D  ;D

And you wench, it seems like I pricked your ego at some point. Sorry about that. I'll learn to be careful with fragile things going forward.

Back to the topic, just to clarify, not necessarily all Indians are as brilliant as you are...evolving into a blossomed intellect within her own vacuum...

hahahaha - you really made my day - i had predicted that this would be your typical response  ;D  ;D i ROCK!

TheWall is naat so istrong after-all and is crumbling away....tut tut!
« Last Edit: May 08, 2007, 09:16:32 AM by pipsqueak »
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dextrous

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Re: <NON CRIC> Police: our willing executioners
« Reply #32 on: May 08, 2007, 07:38:35 AM »
The matches for the next PPV are lining-up quite nicely!
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pipsqueak

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Re: <NON CRIC> Police: our willing executioners
« Reply #33 on: May 08, 2007, 07:40:51 AM »

And, Dravid bhaiyya, while you are at it, do try responding to http://www.cricketvoice.com/cricketforum2/index.php?topic=10238.msg129583#msg129583.



Please don't nag men like this. If a man does not respond, and esp if a group of them dont respond, you must get that they dont think your post is woth responding to. Refrain from creating ackwardness by seeking attention and nagging. Swallow it like a ......  ;)


That was like swell ::cheers:: ::cheers:: ::cheers::


you are like..err..like...like.. so teenager-ish.  ;D  swell?
« Last Edit: May 08, 2007, 07:47:22 AM by pipsqueak »
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fineleg

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Re: <NON CRIC> Police: our willing executioners
« Reply #34 on: May 08, 2007, 07:52:41 AM »

And, Dravid bhaiyya, while you are at it, do try responding to http://www.cricketvoice.com/cricketforum2/index.php?topic=10238.msg129583#msg129583.



Please don't nag men like this. If a man does not respond, and esp if a group of them dont respond, you must get that they dont think your post is woth responding to. Refrain from creating ackwardness by seeking attention and nagging. Swallow it like a ......  ;)


That was like swell ::cheers:: ::cheers:: ::cheers::


you are like..err..like...like.. so teenager-ish.  ;D  swell?


Yakka, swell  :notworthy:
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pipsqueak

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Re: <NON CRIC> Police: our willing executioners
« Reply #35 on: May 08, 2007, 07:59:48 AM »

And, Dravid bhaiyya, while you are at it, do try responding to http://www.cricketvoice.com/cricketforum2/index.php?topic=10238.msg129583#msg129583.



Please don't nag men like this. If a man does not respond, and esp if a group of them dont respond, you must get that they dont think your post is woth responding to. Refrain from creating ackwardness by seeking attention and nagging. Swallow it like a ......  ;)


That was like swell ::cheers:: ::cheers:: ::cheers::


you are like..err..like...like.. so teenager-ish.  ;D  swell?


Yakka, swell  :notworthy:


nice to see the sensitive swell sweethearts stick together - you shd form the SSS society..hehe.
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pipsqueak

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Re: <NON CRIC> Police: our willing executioners
« Reply #36 on: May 08, 2007, 08:46:22 AM »
The Wall,
Learn something man. With a moniker like yours, you are NEVER, repeat , NEVER going to find any of the Gangulians miss an opportunity to put you down no matter the topic is finance, society or cricket. Happens all the time! Its called ganging gangulianing up on someone...favorite pasttime. :icon_thumleft:

I told you stop explaining yourself to FP - but now I've figured u get a certain pleasure in arguing, so sure go ahead. But remember the above "repeat".


PS: SG brought in and sgusa's theory vindicated ::kingkong::

I must admit I thought you were exaggerating... no longer so  ;D

Little did I realise that the unoriginal, the old and the weak alike would have been offended enough to gang up on me  ;)

You did not hate GC with all your guts (doesn't matter if you disliked him a little or more than little - did you plain burning hate him?) No.

Thats more than enough to offend many here. And, they will remember that you did not hate GC forever now.

Since there was no mention of Ganguly or GC in this thread... I assumed it was safe ground. Apparently not.

As to not wanting to skin GC alive,  its my parents fault. They are from the southern India.  ;D

Well, you learnt a lesson that others have learnt the hard way as well  :icon_jokercolor:

nah, this post was a riot regardless of GC or SG or boycott's mom-in-law!  of course, you will try to use it to garner support for your "cause". oh, woe be the SSS society!    ;D
« Last Edit: May 08, 2007, 08:48:17 AM by pipsqueak »
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fineleg

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Re: <NON CRIC> Police: our willing executioners
« Reply #37 on: May 08, 2007, 09:13:09 AM »

nah, this post was a riot regardless of GC or SG or boycott's mom-in-law!  of course, you will try to use it to garner support for your "cause". oh, woe be the SSS society!    ;D

Babe,
You are just jealous of me! Green with envy!

[youtube=425,350]uTJGWYk4Kyo [/youtube]
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pipsqueak

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Re: <NON CRIC> Police: our willing executioners
« Reply #38 on: May 08, 2007, 09:14:21 AM »

nah, this post was a riot regardless of GC or SG or boycott's mom-in-law!  of course, you will try to use it to garner support for your "cause". oh, woe be the SSS society!    ;D

Babe,
You are just jealous of me!


you are getting "funnier" by the minute - hope you are on medication for these delusions.  i mean, there is cure! ;D
« Last Edit: May 08, 2007, 09:19:29 AM by pipsqueak »
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feverpitch

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Re: <NON CRIC> Police: our willing executioners
« Reply #39 on: May 08, 2007, 09:40:16 AM »
If copy-pasting were wisdom, the world would be enlightened in a day and we'd have no more of these debates.   ;D
I know you dont think much of originality, but please, for the sake of the nation you seem to care about, embody some it.
Copying will get you some place, like the US, but never to the top  :icon_thumleft:
On the contrary, there is something called a pastiche. For the first time, however, I see this rhetoric device being used to do a great hack job on an otherwise decent post.  ;D ;D
as some dude

Off with your head. Calling Achutank... ...! ;D

said about modern art, you first prove yourself capable of art, then you get the right to pass off any crap as modern art.

Not for those with blinkered visions.

once FB

You sure are one smarmy TWat!

puts out something making sense, of his own - thats the catch - he can have all the pasture..pastich ...whatever it is he wants...

And who sits at the judge's table? Don't say you yourself? There wouldn't be any executioner left then!

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